Horses as food livestock?

jbm150

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I know there are a lot of horse enthusiasts here and for for those that haven't seen the article

Horses could soon be slaughtered for food


So with the rationale given (to minimize abused and neglected animals), are cats and dogs next?


If this belongs in TWH, my apologies
 

Walk Alone

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I don't eat any animals, so I can no more envision eating a cow or chicken than eating a horse. My main concern is the treatment of animals prior to and during the butchering process. With the haste and poor planning that the project in the article emits, I'm sure the animal care and welfare will get kicked under the table, as per industry standard.
 

AzJohn

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There are probably more countries that eat horse than countries that don't. In the US we tend to make all of our animals members of the family. In other parts of the world they are just animals, and as such can be used a important food items.
 

Shell

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As a lifelong horse person (showing, training, racehorses etc.) It's not so much the eating of horses that bothers me, as the fact that the horse industry itself has caused this to happen. Show breeders, and race breeders etc churn out soooo many animals in the hopes of that next champion, that not much thought or consideration goes into what happens to all the ones that didn't make the cut. Not all farms of course, there are some that truly care for every animal they produce, but the larger majority do not.

Many many people can't afford their horses anymore, and the market just isn't what it was, for your average pleasure horse (ie. not big time show horse or racehorse but just a pet type.) Therefore, there are very large amounts of unwanted horses out there, and something has to be done about them. I see people giving horses all the time, and not old, half dead childrens ponies, but good quality horses....I get regular calls from people I have ridden and trained for...do you want "this horse." It's sad but it's been a long time coming. People just aren't buying.

It's sad to me that it has come to this, again not so much in using them as food, but just the whole situation in itself. That said, I likely would not try horse meat, simply because horses are and have always been such a huge part of my life, both my professional life and growing up, I just don't think I could try it.
 

zonbonzovi

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So with the rationale given (to minimize abused and neglected animals), are cats and dogs next?
I hope so(and I love my kitties). Since the whole spay and neuter thing never caught on:rolleyes: the forgotten or never-were-to-be pets could be used for something besides holding down pallets of cardboard behind supermarkets. Couldn't be worse anything sold in the discount freezer aisle. Could we do the same with humans? Other than sentimentality, I just don't see the distinction between eating a cow, chicken, shark, pony or duck. Even though I continue to eat the flesh, I am fully cognizant that raising any animal for consumption is a terribly inefficient use of food resources. (Hits submit reply, waits patiently for rabid backlash)
 

pavel

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I know quite a few people who would get up in arms over this. Personally, it doesn't bother me in the least. For that matter, as has been mentioned, cats and dogs are eaten in many parts of the world as are rats and guinea pigs. Eating them (the unwanted ones/strays/ferals) would be a sensible means of controlling their numbers.
 

catfishrod69

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i mostly agree with you..although i couldnt raise anything to eat....i have no problems at all hunting it wild though....and if a wild horse were to pop in front of my tree stand, sucks to be him....and plus one on the human thing...humans are overpopulating big time...we need a super strict limit on the number of kids a person can have....
I hope so(and I love my kitties). Since the whole spay and neuter thing never caught on:rolleyes: the forgotten or never-were-to-be pets could be used for something besides holding down pallets of cardboard behind supermarkets. Couldn't be worse anything sold in the discount freezer aisle. Could we do the same with humans? Other than sentimentality, I just don't see the distinction between eating a cow, chicken, shark, pony or duck. Even though I continue to eat the flesh, I am fully cognizant that raising any animal for consumption is a terribly inefficient use of food resources. (Hits submit reply, waits patiently for rabid backlash)
 

pitbulllady

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This topic has been discussed extensively over on the Yahoo Pet Law Group, and of course, there is a lot of misunderstanding about what this means. A few years ago, HSUS pushed through a ban on slaughtering horses and processing them for their meat, whether for human or animal consumption. Now, understand, that NO one in the US raises horses for food; the horses that were being sent to the slaughterhouses were horses that were destined to be killed anyway, either because they were old, in poor health with no chance of recovery, of a dangerous or vicious disposition(yes, there ARE some really nasty and dangerous horses and they do kill several people each year), or simply cannot be ridden for whatever reason. It costs a lot of money to maintain a horse, and to keep one that is in bad health or that is aggressive is not something that most people can afford. There are, as has been pointed out, simply more horses than there are homes for them. This ban on horse slaughter combined with the high cost of euthanizing a horse and disposing of the very large carcass has resulted in a widespread epidemic of horses being abandoned, starved and otherwise horribly abused, rather than preventing said abuse. Essentially, the ban stripped those unwanted horses of what value they DID have, which was the value of their meat, and this opens the door for the aforementioned problems. To make things worse, horses were still being trucked across the border to Mexico to slaughter plants there, where even the most minimal standards of humane slaughter and treatment prior to slaughter are non-existant. The USDA came to realization that rather than prevent horses from being abused, the ban on slaughter was actually CAUSING more horrific treatment of these animals. If a person had a horse they did not want or could not keep, for whatever reason, and they could not find a buyer or give it away, they were left with no options while the ban was in effect unless they were lucky enough to find a horse rescue that was not already inundated with unwanted animals. They could either abandon the horse(which many did), shoot it and bury it at their own expense, or allow it to simply starve and then dispose of it, or sell it to a Mexican slaughter house for a couple of bucks if they could find a means of getting it there. Now, at least, it has enough value as a meat animal to provide an incentive not to abandon it or starve it. Again, that value is not sufficient to warrant breeding horses, not a cheap endeavor by any means, just for that purpose, so the horses that wind up in the US slaughter facilities are animals that were going to be killed, anyway.

pitbulllady
 

bugmankeith

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Why just because a horse cant be ridden or is deemed worthless should it be killed, this in itself has and will always be a debate just like we all know in race horses used to be killed when they didnt win after a while and some farms keep many horses just as companions even if they have no "purpose" as others would say, our pets have no purpose to us but we still keep them, right.

Then the other fact, I never heard of any places that "humanely" kill what we eat. Not only are selling sick/diseased animal meat to feed us wrong, and finding meat loaded with antibiotics which isnt healthy for anyone to eat, the less tainted meat they sell the better. IMO most meat we buy is unhealthy, unless they raise and slaughter animals humanely and raise them to be healthy and not loaded with antibiotics.

I saw how they slaughter a horse and it's not a quick and humane death, same as cows.

I never ate horse meat and I never will. It's bad enough there hardly any good quality food sold to begin with to eat.

Lets make a law to improve all meat farms!
 

mmfh

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My .02 is that eating animals is fine. I have a problem with the techniques used at the slaughter houses that are not humane. Eat an animal....fine but don't cause it suffering just because its going to be food. Personally I want my steaks, of whatever species, to be given due respect before and at the time of their death.
 

Louise E. Rothstein

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Joel Salatin has written about slaughter techniques.
And so has Temple Grandin.
Their work reveals that the animals involved do not have to be tortured.
-And the HUMANS involved do not have to do torture.

The last includes people who buy meat...
Many of Joel's customers bypass slaughterhouses that are not humane.

Many more of us could learn to do the same thing.
And I hope that we do.
 

pitbulllady

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Why just because a horse cant be ridden or is deemed worthless should it be killed, this in itself has and will always be a debate just like we all know in race horses used to be killed when they didnt win after a while and some farms keep many horses just as companions even if they have no "purpose" as others would say, our pets have no purpose to us but we still keep them, right.

Then the other fact, I never heard of any places that "humanely" kill what we eat. Not only are selling sick/diseased animal meat to feed us wrong, and finding meat loaded with antibiotics which isnt healthy for anyone to eat, the less tainted meat they sell the better. IMO most meat we buy is unhealthy, unless they raise and slaughter animals humanely and raise them to be healthy and not loaded with antibiotics.

I saw how they slaughter a horse and it's not a quick and humane death, same as cows.

I never ate horse meat and I never will. It's bad enough there hardly any good quality food sold to begin with to eat.

Lets make a law to improve all meat farms!
Keith, just what do you suggest be done with the thousands of unwanted horses in the US, the ones that are old and sick, or vicious(yes, there is such a thing as a vicious and dangerous horse, however it got to be that way), or the ones whose owners simply cannot afford to care for them or no longer will be able to keep them for whatever reason? Horse rescues are overflowing with such animals, and many of THEM have wound up unable to care for the animals they took in, resulting in neglect. Horses are very expensive animals to keep, and they require a lot of space. And then there is the issue of veterinary care; you can't just put a horse in your backseat and drive it to the vet. You have to get the vet to come out to where the horse is, IF you can find a vet that will treat large animals these days, and that means than in addition to paying for his time and the cost of the medication/treatment, you will also pay for his gasoline. I don't know if you keep up with the news, but a lot of people have been losing their homes and property due to foreclosures, lost jobs, etc. If such a person had a horse, what are they going to do with it now that they will be moving into smaller housing(IF they can find housing that is affordable)? In a good and thriving economy, something as expensive to care for as a horse isn't as much of a burden, but now? Many owners simply find themselves unable to maintain the upkeep on those animals, and there simply is no market for them. You can't just sell it, because the buyers aren't there. The rescues are filled past their real capacity. Many people find that their only options are to have a vet euthanize the horse, which can be very expensive, and then there's the issue of what to do with a 1,000-pound animal carcass. If you're lucky enough to own a large rural acreage and a backhoe, you can take care of that for a few hundred bucks, but what if you don't have a place or means to bury it, or that is illegal to do? This is not like putting the dead cat in a box and burying it under a tree, after all. Landfills won't take livestock carcasses. Many people, faced with the dilemma of having to get rid of a horse that no one wants, simply have abandoned the horses to starve or be shot at or attacked by predators or wander onto a highway, whatever. No one wants to have horses killed, but the reality is that there are a LOT of horses that absolutely no one wants, so just what should be done with those horses?

pitbulllady
 

Anastasia

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My .02 is that eating animals is fine. ...
Agh, depend..., Cat is an animal too, personally I wont eat cat or dog, or for the same reason any other pet related varmints like guinea pigs, hamsters etc(even so in some countries those are on a menu)
I love horses and owned several over the years, even so back in my country when I was a kid we did ate pretty much all farm animals (cow, horse, sheep, goat, chicken, I may missed couple)
 

jbm150

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This was interesting to see people's takes on this. I don't like being around horses; they're too unpredictable (to me) and so powerful a simple flick of the hoof could kill me. I didn't know about the country's horse problem but it makes sense given the state of the economy. It's pretty sad so many have to suffer because people can't afford to give them good homes. As to eating them, I'd eat anything and everything, I have no big qualms about that. I love dogs and cats, especially cats, but wouldn't have a problem eating one. It would also go a long way towards abating the stray problem ;)

As an aside, my biggest problems with the meat industry are the poor conditions in which the animals are kept and the absolute crappy diet they're fed. I can't afford free-range, natural diet livestock so I support the industry with my dollars and forfeit my right to complain.
 

Bigboy

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I know there are a lot of horse enthusiasts here and for for those that haven't seen the article

Horses could soon be slaughtered for food


So with the rationale given (to minimize abused and neglected animals), are cats and dogs next?


If this belongs in TWH, my apologies
Cats and dogs would be very costly since they require animal protein. I imagine this alone would keep them from being "next". I'm all for eating horses however, I just don't see it ever taking off because of how absolutely nuts horse lovers are. There is also the difficulty of horses not having been bred for carcass quality like our domestic breeds that have traditionally been a food source.

I hope so(and I love my kitties). Could we do the same with humans? Other than sentimentality, I just don't see the distinction between eating a cow, chicken, shark, pony or duck. Even though I continue to eat the flesh, I am fully cognizant that raising any animal for consumption is a terribly inefficient use of food resources. (Hits submit reply, waits patiently for rabid backlash)
The biological issue with eating humans is the risk of transmitting prions. Cultures which practice(d) cannibalism have always had issues with them, making it mainstream would do the same thing.
 
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jbm150

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Cats and dogs would be very costly since they require animal protein. I imagine this alone would keep them from being "next".
I was just pseudo-kidding. Besides, I'm sure we'd come up with a corn/soy-based feed to give them :rolleyes:
 

NikiP

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Was lurking & this thread caught my eye.

This is just in time as I foresee things getting a LOT worse before they get better. Right now Texas is a HUGE HUGE HUGE issue. The drought & fire has killed their hay & most the pastures. So they've been buying cuts from other states, well, those who are staying in horses there. Going into winter, those other states are now realizing they are lacking in hay. This will also effect many of the milk barns up north as not all types of hay are the same & there can be a large range in quality from area to area. Texas & surrounding states have been looking at increases of double to triple the normal costs, talking $20-30 for a small bale & around $150 for a round, & we aren't even talking about the people being concerned about the quality :( The worst part is people are saying this drought is going to be here a while, i've read scientist/farmers are predicting into 2020. Pretty bad when the cattle farmers start offloading all their stock (including youngsters, which are their future, not just sending the "to slaughter" ones off early.) So what happens when the water runs out in Texas?

And as for body disposal, many states/counties/towns have laws regarding disposal of large bodies. This includes limiting distance of burial from houses & water. Unless you own a large piece of land, you are SOL on a place to bury. Horses are easiest buried where they can be drugged/shot & aimed to fall into the plot.

I love horses, majored in college in them, but I foresee horses becoming things of the past unless things change.
 

jbm150

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^So I guess we can look forward to even higher milk, cheese, and beef prices very soon :(
 

Louise E. Rothstein

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Dear jbm:

Please consider getting in touch with your nearest advocate for "Community Supported Agriculture."
If you help them out they help YOU to afford really good food that you think you cannot afford now.

People do bypass those foul factory farms.

They are not all rich people.

Quite a few are like you.
 
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