Why do male Ts die not too long after maturity?

Spider-man 2 · Aug 1, 2004

I dunno if this is a stupid question or not. I have always just accepted them dying after maturity, but never asked why. So now I am. ;P

Anyone know? Does it have to do with thier anatomy/internal systems?

Thanks in advance!

8 leg wonder · Aug 1, 2004

one of the reasons is that a male T would not be able to have a successful postultimate molt, the bulbed ends of the pedipalps would get stuck and it would die

Spider-man 2 · Aug 1, 2004

I am talking like natural causes, like when they just curl up and die.

Shiver · Aug 1, 2004

I am assuming it has to do with their anatomy after their adult molt and their metabolism. Like people when we get old, our body no longer functions like it is supposed to.

8 leg wonder · Aug 1, 2004

Old age, most likely burnt out from trying to find a female!

ShaunHolder · Aug 1, 2004

8 leg wonder said:
one of the reasons is that a male T would not be able to have a successful postultimate molt, the bulbed ends of the pedipalps would get stuck and it would die

Never heard this before.

8 leg wonder · Aug 1, 2004

Its in Shultze's book "the tarantula keepers guide", he said he has only seen 3 T successful get through a post-ultimate molt, 1 lost its palps, another had difformed palps,don't remember what happened with the other one. All 3 were sterile due to the fact that they did not have the proper tools for sex(pedipalps). they all died a few months later

The Red Queen · Aug 1, 2004

I have had 2 A. avicularia males attempt post ultimate molts, and both were disasters. The first lost both pedipalps and 2 legs, and basically bled to death a short while later. The other became hopelessly caught up in his old skin (all but 2 legs were stuck), and after unsuccessful attempts to help him get free of the molt I euthanized him... the poor guy was suffering

Immortal_sin · Aug 1, 2004

8 leg wonder said:
one of the reasons is that a male T would not be able to have a successful postultimate molt, the bulbed ends of the pedipalps would get stuck and it would die

not always true....see
<HERE>

and <HERE>

for more information on post ultimate molting....and survival......

MyNameHere · Aug 1, 2004

8 leg wonder said:
Its in Shultze's book "the tarantula keepers guide", he said he has only seen 3 T successful get through a post-ultimate molt, 1 lost its palps, another had difformed palps,don't remember what happened with the other one. All 3 were sterile due to the fact that they did not have the proper tools for sex(pedipalps). they all died a few months later

I think the "stuck pedipalps" is just conjecture on Schultz's part. They don't mention this as a definitive cause of death or reason for lack of post-ultimate moults. If that was the only reason I don't know how sturdy it would be, anyway. I mean, think of all the times mature females moult and pull a big ol' abdomen thru their tiny pedicel; everything inside is soft for a moult so they can get it all out.

It would make more sense to assume that it has to do with old age in the same way humans' bodies stop doing things as well as they used to once they reach a certain age. Why male T's have such a significantly shorter lifespan is a mystery. Maybe it's a device to ensure genetic diversity by limiting the number of mating seasons a male can produce offspring. It's not the only case of this sort of thing happening in the animal kingdom. There's a species of rodent wherein the males reach sexual maturity in the course of a season (like their female counterparts), then they all come together for a massive orgy. Then the males die. The females live on to raise the offspring and sometimes to do it all again, but the guys get that one shot.

Philth · Aug 2, 2004

not always true....see

...and he's still going....

ShaunHolder · Aug 2, 2004

Philth said:
...and he's still going....

I really like how he looks. Do you have more pics of him or a gallery you could link to?

Malhavoc's · Aug 2, 2004

ShaunHolder said:
Never heard this before.

I had a Mature Grass spider molt out after reaching maturity [considering its a true spider it was extremely rare] at first it threw its palsp then after another month it molted into an extremely deformed and mutilated creature that couldn't even feed anymore. Safe to say it died two weeks later of bad mold conditions.

ShaunHolder · Aug 2, 2004

Yeah. I had no idea that the palps caused so much problems with the post ultimate molt. I'm havent had a male reach maturity so this is the first time I've heard of this.

usumbaraboy · Aug 2, 2004

k one question what is a post ultimate molt? iv never heard of it sorry to ask and have some explain it to me but it seems very interesting and i know a guy with a mature male rud rump so could u tell me what a post ultimate molt is. thanks

Atalanta · Aug 2, 2004

usumbaraboy said:
k one question what is a post ultimate molt? iv never heard of it sorry to ask and have some explain it to me but it seems very interesting and i know a guy with a mature male rud rump so could u tell me what a post ultimate molt is. thanks

The ultimate molt is the molt in which males mature (i.e., get their pedipalps). A post-ultimate molt is a molt that occurs thereafter.

Spider-man 2 · Aug 2, 2004

usumbaraboy said:
k one question what is a post ultimate molt? iv never heard of it sorry to ask and have some explain it to me but it seems very interesting and i know a guy with a mature male rud rump so could u tell me what a post ultimate molt is. thanks

It's when they molt after ultimate molt (maturity molt). It's very rare that a male will molt after maturity and even more rare for it to survive.

Ultimate Instar · Aug 2, 2004

Just a guess, but I suspect that a long-lived individual has greater metabolic needs than a short-lived one. For example, a Galapogas (sp?) tortoise has to worry about developing cancer due to several decades of exposure to UV radiation, so it probably has better DNA repair mechanisms in it's cells. A fruitfly doesn't have the same problem so I doubt that it invests a lot in the extra metabolic cost of preventing DNA errors. So there's a trade-off between getting enough food to reach maturity and living long enough to reproduce. That's one factor that occurs to me but there are undoubtedly other forces at work. Since Ts are not the best-studied critters around, who knows what evolutionary forces are at work. That's too bad; spiders are incredibly ancient (400 million years) and relatively unchanged by evolution for the last 100-200 million years. They must be doing something right.

Karen N.

Why do male Ts die not too long after maturity?

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