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RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:19 AM
Okay, My "female" has arrived and she is TWICE as small as my "MALE". Is this correct???? Cant be!!! Is it possible I had a female all this time and ordered another one??? NOOOOO Can two females live together????? I am pissed and confused!

errit
01-05-2005, 10:29 AM
femal A. Bicolor?
I wouldn't put 2 females together if i where u. 2 woman just don't mix:)
twice as small is a big difference. is it full grown allready. maybe it is an entirely different species.

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:30 AM
http://tinypic.com/16hswp
http://tinypic.com/16ht0n

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:37 AM
It was suppost to be thier "largest female". If this is the largest adult female, them mine must be on steroids! Im still going to see how they react towards each other and then make a nice thick divider.

errit
01-05-2005, 10:42 AM
nice photos. its indeed a big difference. check out the first tail segment. if one of them has 3 lines of rubbles (or whatever you call them) running through and the other once 2 (middle is missing) than you have 2 different species.

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:47 AM
thier tails both look the same. I put in a divider made out of a cereal box HAHA and the new one is going crazy running around. I guess im gonna have to keep them separate. This really sucks. I expected a huge female and got a squirt. This ones pedipals and very long and slender compared to the large one. But its just so small. I somehow have this feeling one of them is going to get under the divider by digging.........

skinheaddave
01-05-2005, 11:34 AM
Can you take a shot of the chela of the new one?

Cheers,
Dave

G. Carnell
01-05-2005, 11:37 AM
there is variation in sizes among adults,
maybe a HUGE male and a TICHY female you have!?


from that pic, it looks like the female is the male, and the male the female? :(

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 11:50 AM
=D
http://tinypic.com/16hzer
http://tinypic.com/16hzf9

ScorpionKing83
01-05-2005, 12:47 PM
Is an A. Bicolor, an all black A.A ?????

G. Carnell
01-05-2005, 01:18 PM
or maybe an AA is a totally yellow(ish) AB!

youll find A.crassicauda and A.mauretanicus are also "black "versions" of AA" in terms of general looks

theyr wicked! everytime a pic is posted i want one even more

skinheaddave
01-05-2005, 02:08 PM
The chela do appear to be razor-thin = female. Perhaps still a subadult? Females don't exhibit a huge change at maturity, so it could be hard to tell.

Cheers,
Dave

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 02:14 PM
So you think its possible that I have an adult male and sub-adult female? Is there the slightest possibility they can live together without killing each other? I have em separated but would really like to keep em together. The little one is more aggressive right now.

Brian S
01-05-2005, 02:39 PM
Hard to tell in this picture but mine is much smaller as well.

Ythier
01-05-2005, 02:48 PM
Btw, how are you sure that your first specimen is a male ?

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 02:50 PM
im pretty sure, ive been trying to sex him since I got him and so far everything points to male. (short pectines, many teeth, slender short pedipalps) Almost everyone agreed its a male.

fusion121
01-05-2005, 03:31 PM
So you think its possible that I have an adult male and sub-adult female? Is there the slightest possibility they can live together without killing each other? I have em separated but would really like to keep em together. The little one is more aggressive right now.

This isn't a social species so you'd be taking a risk, but being a male female pair they could feasibly live together, although when she moulted there would be a very high chance she would be eaten as even the most notoriously social species seem to enjoy nothing more then a nice freshly moulted sibling.

Ythier
01-05-2005, 04:10 PM
im pretty sure, ive been trying to sex him since I got him and so far everything points to male. (short pectines, many teeth, slender short pedipalps) Almost everyone agreed its a male.
I just ask you that because your specimen seems to be very fat, and all the males bicolor I had (4 so far) were very slim since the last molt and ate almost nothing (they have also quite long pectines)...
Females 20-27 denticles, males 26-32 denticles.
Greetings,
Eric
(PS. Regarding the sociability, I had couples of Androctonus, but also some females together without problem, on the other hand young (except of course 2nd-3rd instars) are very aggressives and can't be kept together).

skinheaddave
01-05-2005, 04:51 PM
The chela of the "male" on the other thread with pictures seemed rather bulbous = male. You are right that it does seem a bit chubby. BTW, Razzle, males have the longer pectines, not shorter.

Cheers,
Dave

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 09:57 PM
well they havent gotten through the divider yet. Both seem calm. New female is very thin. Have they even been feeding her?? Poor thing looks like she hasent eaten in months.

mimic58
01-05-2005, 10:07 PM
nice pics how long do these things live on avarage?

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:24 PM
Not too long. Id say 5-6 years. Not sure though.

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-05-2005, 10:27 PM
The chela of the "male" on the other thread with pictures seemed rather bulbous = male. You are right that it does seem a bit chubby. BTW, Razzle, males have the longer pectines, not shorter.

Cheers,
Dave
Sorry, I meant to say that the male has Longer pectines, not shorter. Im so freaking confused and stressed today I dont know what im talking about. :(

Wolvie56X
01-05-2005, 10:59 PM
long thin chella are female, shorter ones with a bubble near the hand joint are males, at least thats how i sexed all my scorps cept the Hadrusus species

a lil harder to sex A Australis though

Ythier
01-06-2005, 02:37 AM
Hi,
It's true for a few genus like Parabuthus spp and Androctonus spp, and not all the species of these genus. In my experience, my males A.australis had chelas more bulbous, but not my males mauritanicus or bicolor. I will try to put a photo.
Greetings,
Eric

G. Carnell
01-06-2005, 08:48 AM
long thin chella are female, shorter ones with a bubble near the hand joint are males, at least thats how i sexed all my scorps cept the Hadrusus species

a lil harder to sex A Australis though
Hi,
its not male=bulbous female=thin in terms of claws for all species
just most buthids i think

Nazgul
01-06-2005, 02:18 PM
...but not my males mauritanicus or bicolor. I will try to put a photo.
Greetings,
Eric

Hi,

I agree, I donīt see any difference in the maleīs and female chelae of the specimens in my possession either. The only way I determined their sexes was to count the pectinal teeth.
`
Greetings
Alex

skinheaddave
01-06-2005, 03:19 PM
Interesting. I see a noteable difference between males and females I have preserved.

Cheers,
Dave

Nazgul
01-06-2005, 04:09 PM
Hi,

maybe it depends on the subspecies. Where are your specimens from, Dave?

Greetings
Alex

Ythier
01-06-2005, 04:22 PM
Yes I forgot, mine are b.aeneas, but I think you have some b.bicolor Alex ?
Here's some pics (sexes are sures, they reproduced).
Greetings,
Eric

A.bicolor female........................................A.bi color male
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20galerie/Afrique/Androctonusbicoloraeneas2.jpg http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20galerie/Afrique/Androctonusbicoloraeneas1.jpg

A.mauritanicus female.....................A.mauritanicus male
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20fiches/Androctonus-mauretanicus-pincefemelle.gif http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20fiches/Androctonus-mauretanicus-pincemale.gif

G. Carnell
01-06-2005, 05:31 PM
not much difference in "bulbosity"........

this is confusing

Wolvie56X
01-06-2005, 08:57 PM
well as you can see, there is a gap in the males claw that allows him to hold the females claws while doing minimal damage

mimic58
01-06-2005, 09:09 PM
Yes I forgot, mine are b.aeneas, but I think you have some b.bicolor Alex ?
Here's some pics (sexes are sures, they reproduced).
Greetings,
Eric


Now that is an Ugly little B*****d I sure as hell wouldnt want to wake up next to one of thoughs!!! :eek:

skinheaddave
01-08-2005, 01:31 AM
With any luck I will get some pics tommorow and I can show you what I'm talking about.

Cheers,
Dave

RaZeDaHeLL666
01-08-2005, 09:35 AM
Hey, I caught the two of them going crazy yesterday morniing. The young one was clinging on to the divider, just barely hanging off. The large male was on the top of the screen on the OPPOSITE side of where he was suppost to be. It took me 15 minutes just to get him to let go of the screen (useing cardboards and deli cup). So I went to the store and bought a 2 1/2 gallon tank and separated the little scorps. Thank god now I have nothing to worry about. I would really love to see them live together but I just cant worry every day about them killing each other. ;P I hope that when the female matures (and she is a female, I saw her little pectines) that I can introduce them and safely have a good successful mate. ;)

Ythier
01-11-2005, 03:13 AM
Yes I forgot, mine are b.aeneas, but I think you have some b.bicolor Alex ?
Here's some pics (sexes are sures, they reproduced).
Greetings,
Eric

A.bicolor female........................................A.bi color male
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20galerie/Afrique/Androctonusbicoloraeneas2.jpg http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20galerie/Afrique/Androctonusbicoloraeneas1.jpg

A.mauritanicus female.....................A.mauritanicus male
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20fiches/Androctonus-mauretanicus-pincefemelle.gif http://perso.wanadoo.fr/eycb/scorpions/Images/Photos%20fiches/Androctonus-mauretanicus-pincemale.gif


Hi,
Here's a better pic of the hand of an adult male.
Not very bulbous...
Greetings,
Eric

skinheaddave
01-11-2005, 04:36 AM
Eric,

Perhaps "bulbous" was the wrong term. But look at the line formed along the back edge of the manus and fixed finger. The female's almost follows a perfectly smooth line, whereas the males bulges out slightly. You can't see it in the last picture there, since the angle is too low. My camera is currently at work, but I did just take a look at my specimens and found that this observation was consistent with the specimen's sex as determined by the pectines and general body morphology.

Cheers,
Dave

Ythier
01-11-2005, 07:42 AM
Hi Dave,
I just had a look on my b.aeneas in alcohol...and this line seems to be more bulging that on the male ! ;)
But as Alex said, perhaps we have different subspecies.
In my opinion the best way to sex this species is the general morphology.
Greetings,
Eric

skinheaddave
01-11-2005, 01:19 PM
Eric,



But as Alex said, perhaps we have different subspecies.

This seems probable. I respect you and know you know what you're talking about -- but I know what I'm seeing. I have no idea on collection locale for my specimens.


In my opinion the best way to sex this species is the general morphology.
It is definitely the easiest -- being able to see the male's pectines when looking down from above is a pretty good clue. ;)

Cheers,
Dave

Ythier
01-11-2005, 03:25 PM
It is definitely the easiest -- being able to see the male's pectines when looking down from above is a pretty good clue. ;)
Yes, don't know why Fet & co don't put this efficient key in their papers ! ;)