Calcium...another stupid question...

W

Wish_mastera

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Hi all. I want to ask you something. I've hared that T's may have problems with molting, when they have eaten a lots of vertebrals(that is tha case with my T. Blondi)
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=58710

T's coudn't get enough Calcium and the hard shells and fang coudn't form rightly. I've also heared thath they get calcium from crickets, roaches, grasshoppers and so. My blondi hasn't got fang now(they are half lenged) and I cut the legs and wings of the insects who drop in her tank. I think its easier for her to eat them so.... My question is: From where the T's gain Calcium from insects? From the legs and wings, or from the whole cricket?
 
MindUtopia

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My guess would be that it's from the exoskeleton, but compared to vertebrates, I would imagine the amount of calcium in invertebrate prey is fairly negligible and not something to be concerned about.
 
moricollins

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the theory about calcium with tarantulas and moulting is *if i remember properly* that too much calcium is a bad thing and can lead to moults without fangs. Crickets themselves don't contain calcium (or if they do it is a very insignificant amount).
 
Camberwell

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hmm, dont they put calcium in the water supply???

Tiny had a fang missing/deformed once, i wonder if its tap water???
 
MindUtopia

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They put flouride in the tap water, but there will be a small amount of calcium in any tap water just from the natural surroundings. But it's probably pretty small compared to say the bones in a pinkie.
 
Mike H.

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I personally cant see tap water being a problem, its all I ever used for years now....

Regards, Mike
 
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Wish_mastera

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Mike H I want to ask you how much costed blondi spiderling in your country? I've heared that in Canada the prices for T's and other exotic animals are very high? Is this true? In Germany I think is about 20 euro. In my country is about 30 euro...
 
Windchaser

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As Mori stated, the theory is that too much calcium causes the problem, not the lack of it. The speculation is that the calcium interacts with the magnesium in the tarantulas exoskeleton thereby reduced the strength of the exoskeleton. It is speculated that the fangs and chelicerae contain more magnesium and are therefore more susceptible to the problem. Calcium is used for the production of bones and therefore is not a necessity for invertebrates. I guess the jury is still out on whether too much of it is harmful.
 
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Midnightrdr456

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wind beat me to it. But yea the calcium is the problem (or so believed). Thats why I decided not to feed mice often to my blondi (orginally i figured feeding less often, 1 item, no cultivating, mice were so much easier, but now ive reconsidered).

Im pretty sure its like was stated before, its the intense amounts of calcium in prey with bones (when compared to the calcium that would be maybe in water which is insignificant IMO).
 
TheDarkFinder

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I do not know where all these "theories" keep coming from. :wall: :wall: :wall:
thedarkfinder
 
Mike H.

Mike H.

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Wish_mastera said:
Mike H I want to ask you how much costed blondi spiderling in your country? I've heared that in Canada the prices for T's and other exotic animals are very high? Is this true? In Germany I think is about 20 euro. In my country is about 30 euro...
Click to expand...

Greetings, here in Canada an " average " price for a one inch blondi sling is around $ 60 to $ 80 dollars...


Regsrds, Mike :eek:
 
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TheDarkFinder said:
I do not know where all these "theories" keep coming from. :wall: :wall: :wall:
thedarkfinder
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Well the theory just comes from logically analyzing it (but no proof obviously). Vert. prey obviously has more calcium than inverts. And T's dont use calcium, so supposedly calcium depletes magnesium. Whether this is true or not though I cant say (im not a scientist, or even a science major lol)
 
Windchaser

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TheDarkFinder said:
I do not know where all these "theories" keep coming from. :wall: :wall: :wall:
thedarkfinder
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There was speculation that calcium caused problems after hearing of a significant number of T. blondi and A. geniculata tarantulas losing fangs after a molt. It was found that all had diets that included a large amount of pinkies and other vertebrates. Some were even fed exclusively on vertebrate prey. Therefore, because these diets were high in calcium, and it is known that calcium and magnesium interact negatively with each other, it was thought the calcium would somehow inhibit proper develop of the fangs.
 
TheDarkFinder

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Windchaser said:
There was speculation that calcium caused problems after hearing of a significant number of T. blondi and A. geniculata tarantulas losing fangs after a molt. It was found that all had diets that included a large amount of pinkies and other vertebrates. Some were even fed exclusively on vertebrate prey. Therefore, because these diets were high in calcium, and it is known that calcium and magnesium interact negatively with each other, it was thought the calcium would somehow inhibit proper develop of the fangs.
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I did a search.
Could you post a link to, or author of, the scientific article? Just want to know the controls and limits of the test.
 
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Midnightrdr456

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this wasnt a test with controls and such as far as im aware, thats why its speculation. If it was tested scientifically as in depth as your asking they could probably give definitive results (i wish they would).

But im not authority on this so if there are tests i would like to see them too
 
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Wish_mastera

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Ok. My english is bad. Can somebody tell me with simple words. Is it good to give calcium (in form of pinkies), because I missunderstand the whole theory. Or more simple... with what sould I feed my T's, that they will not have problems by molting?
 
Windchaser

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TheDarkFinder said:
I did a search.
Could you post a link to, or author of, the scientific article? Just want to know the controls and limits of the test.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I don't have any written references to provide. Darrin Vernier had a presentation regarding this at last year's ATS conference. At that time he indicated that he was trying to get some further research done including some mass spectrometry on various exuvia. I have not heard any more from this. You may want to try and contact Darrin for more information.
 
Windchaser

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Wish_mastera said:
Ok. My english is bad. Can somebody tell me with simple words. Is it good to give calcium (in form of pinkies), because I missunderstand the whole theory. Or more simple... with what sould I feed my T's, that they will not have problems by molting?
Click to expand...
Typically diets of a variety of invertebrate prey (crickets, roaches, superworms, meal worms, wax worms, etc.) are sufficient in providing a healthy diet. I would avoid using any wild caught prey since they may introduce toxins or parasites. Commercially bought prey items or those your raise yourself are generally safe.
 
TheDarkFinder

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Wish_mastera said:
Ok. My english is bad. Can somebody tell me with simple words. Is it good to give calcium (in form of pinkies), because I missunderstand the whole theory. Or more simple... with what sould I feed my T's, that they will not have problems by molting?
Click to expand...
No to pinkies, for seaveral reasons. About calcium, I do not know. Arthpods need calicum for the sclerotinization of ecdysis. Sclerotinization is the process which involes the making sclerotin. Sclerotin is a calcium polyer which gives the cuticle strength. I do not know.
thedarkfinder
 
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