can I feed "Green Cabage Caterpillar" to my tarantulas?

Crysta

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Seems I have an abundance of these... on my kale, grown safely on my patio...what do you guys think?

*edit*


I want to breed them, as it seems like it might be easier to use kale/broccoli then getting all the stuff that silkworms need. Thats why i want to know if they are poisonous.. sorry for the no clarification.
 
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bobusboy

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Test it on one T and see what happens?

IIRC pesticides can be passed down through generations of insects so I wouldn't.
 

le-thomas

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No. I never consider wild insects as food for my spiders, and pesticides are best to be avoided at all costs.
 

Crysta

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heres the critters in question:



---------- Post added 08-07-2012 at 05:58 PM ----------

Test it on one T and see what happens?

IIRC pesticides can be passed down through generations of insects so I wouldn't.
What are IIRC pesticides?

No. I never consider wild insects as food for my spiders, and pesticides are best to be avoided at all costs.
Im kinda bad for feeding bugs to my spiders... lol
 

Aviara

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Because they are outside, I would not recommend feeding them. Best not to take the risk. While you may not use pesticides in your yard, other neighbors may, and these chemicals can drift through groundwater, rain or air and end up where they are not wanted. I personally have never, and will never feed wild-caught insects, simply because the cost of losing a tarantula is higher to me than the cost of buying (or breeding) a few feeder insects.
 

Crysta

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Because they are outside, I would not recommend feeding them. Best not to take the risk. While you may not use pesticides in your yard, other neighbors may, and these chemicals can drift through groundwater, rain or air and end up where they are not wanted. I personally have never, and will never feed wild-caught insects, simply because the cost of losing a tarantula is higher to me than the cost of buying (or breeding) a few feeder insects.
Ah, they are in pots on a high balcony. That was why I was wondering, the plants drink the same water my tarantulas drink as well. I'll keep it in mind thanks! Just wanted to know if the caterpillars themselves where poisonous aside from pesticides as well.
 

Archduke

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A few things to highlight, butterfly larvae sometimes feed on slightly more toxic plants, making them distasteful or cause stomach upsets with their predator, but this works mostly in the case for mammals like birds. I do not know the result if you have fed the Ts butterfly larvae though.

Moth larvae on the other hand will cause skin irritation to mammals, such as ourselves, the larvae may also be coated in urticating hairs like the Ts, although served more as a defensive mechanism against predators, I am not sure how they will react with the Ts. The also may secrete other stuff that is harmful to mammals.

Although not tested, I dont think its worth the risk in feeding the Ts moth or butterfly larvae even though they are pesticide free. Just my 2 cents worth.

Cheers,
Mark
 

Crysta

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it seems they are fine to touch, as i rounded up all of them. I like the idea of breeding these caterpillars, because its way easier to get a bunch of kale all year round then other plants for silkworms and the like. How many generations do you think it would take for the insecticides to go away if I do indeed go through with breeding them?
 

Archduke

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From what I know about butterfly lifecycles is that the larvae is very sensitive to pesticides. So if the caterpillar is fine, your T should be too. You can test it with one or two T first and see how they react to the caterpillars.

If your going to be breeding them, you will need to find someway for the caterpillars to continue their lifecycle again to procude the next batch (which is another ball game all together), unless you intend to just use what you can find in your yard.

Nutrition value of caterpillars vs crickets, I am not very sure though.

Do let us know what your findings are, it'll be interesting to find out how this goes.
 

Crysta

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From what I know about butterfly lifecycles is that the larvae is very sensitive to pesticides. So if the caterpillar is fine, your T should be too. You can test it with one or two T first and see how they react to the caterpillars.

If your going to be breeding them, you will need to find someway for the caterpillars to continue their lifecycle again to procude the next batch (which is another ball game all together), unless you intend to just use what you can find in your yard.

Nutrition value of caterpillars vs crickets, I am not very sure though.

Do let us know what your findings are, it'll be interesting to find out how this goes.
Thanks, great info singapore! I'll let you know. I fed one to my H. gabonensis dwarf yesterday... she's fine, and loves them, will let you know if the others take to it as well.

I googled them and it seems they are non-toxic.

FYI, seems these are the locale bird eating favorites.

heres a better picture of them I found online:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3SYxtrjUEqw/TksWESnCMDI/AAAAAAAAAHU/OxfC4LAe47A/s320/catapillar.jpg
 
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Archduke

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Hi Crysta,

Seems that your little buggers are taking them quite well at the time-being. As a precaution, do check if there are any pesticide spraying going on when you harvest the caterpillars, as they take sometime to die if the concentration is too high.

Cheers,
Mark
 

bobusboy

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IIRC = if i recall correctly


re: your question regarding what are IIRC pesticides.
 

desertanimal

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You won't be able to breed those caterpillars unless you put them back on the kale! Many caterpillars are plant specific once they have hatched and won't eat anything but what they hatched on and first ate. Not all, though. Some are generalists, but most stick to what they know. And then, if you have butterfly larvae (or moth larvae of species that eat as adults), you'll need the host plant for the adult butterfly (or moth).

These caterpillars that were on your kale will only have eaten your kale or, at the very most, something else in your planter. So unless anything there is poisonous to Ts, then that is not an issue.

Personally, I'd feed them. But I am not the most conservative on that issue.
 

Crysta

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Save some for me Crysta!
willl dooo!!

Hi Crysta,

Seems that your little buggers are taking them quite well at the time-being. As a precaution, do check if there are any pesticide spraying going on when you harvest the caterpillars, as they take sometime to die if the concentration is too high.

Cheers,
Mark
Everyone seems like quite the happy spiders... i'd love to do silkworms..but they are just so expensive here in canada ;(
None of my spiders are enjoying the company of superworms... plus they burrow..

You won't be able to breed those caterpillars unless you put them back on the kale! Many caterpillars are plant specific once they have hatched and won't eat anything but what they hatched on and first ate. Not all, though. Some are generalists, but most stick to what they know. And then, if you have butterfly larvae (or moth larvae of species that eat as adults), you'll need the host plant for the adult butterfly (or moth).

These caterpillars that were on your kale will only have eaten your kale or, at the very most, something else in your planter. So unless anything there is poisonous to Ts, then that is not an issue.

Personally, I'd feed them. But I am not the most conservative on that issue.
I fed them some store bought oraganic kale and they seem to be munching well away. I think i may have over fed them.. lol! .... they poop A LOT...how do they get nutrients if its all outside?! lol
 

Archduke

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Research regarding lepidoptera have indicated that swapping host plants (some species have more than 1 host plant) during the first instars of the larvae is possible, however for most species, it is very difficult to do so at the later instars. Then also choosing the right instar larvae to harvest, such as the 5th instar ones rather than the 1st or 2nd. That being said, if the cabbage whites, Genus Pieris, I get correct. They shouldnt reduce the host plant to just stem and branches as they are not that voracious eaters, but there should be a way to sustain the plant healthy to maintain a constant food source. That will probably mean some monitoring and culling of excess larvae may be needed.

Alternatively, you can harvest the eggs/ 1st instar larvae and keep them domestically. Just pluck out some leaves (wiping each leaf with a damp cloth to remove any foreign substance if any) and feed them periodically, so that you will be very sure that the larvae is not parasited or have any chemicals within them.

Cheers,
Mark


You won't be able to breed those caterpillars unless you put them back on the kale! Many caterpillars are plant specific once they have hatched and won't eat anything but what they hatched on and first ate. Not all, though. Some are generalists, but most stick to what they know. And then, if you have butterfly larvae (or moth larvae of species that eat as adults), you'll need the host plant for the adult butterfly (or moth).

These caterpillars that were on your kale will only have eaten your kale or, at the very most, something else in your planter. So unless anything there is poisonous to Ts, then that is not an issue.

Personally, I'd feed them. But I am not the most conservative on that issue.
 

Crysta

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Research regarding lepidoptera have indicated that swapping host plants (some species have more than 1 host plant) during the first instars of the larvae is possible, however for most species, it is very difficult to do so at the later instars. Then also choosing the right instar larvae to harvest, such as the 5th instar ones rather than the 1st or 2nd. That being said, if the cabbage whites, Genus Pieris, I get correct. They shouldnt reduce the host plant to just stem and branches as they are not that voracious eaters, but there should be a way to sustain the plant healthy to maintain a constant food source. That will probably mean some monitoring and culling of excess larvae may be needed.

Alternatively, you can harvest the eggs/ 1st instar larvae and keep them domestically. Just pluck out some leaves (wiping each leaf with a damp cloth to remove any foreign substance if any) and feed them periodically, so that you will be very sure that the larvae is not parasited or have any chemicals within them.

Cheers,
Mark
Awesome, thanks for the info.

So it seems one of the biggers ones decided to turn into a pupae/chrysalis !! Awesome. I wonder if these eggs need to overwinter?
The small ones are being kept in a container and on their second serving of kale for the day. Yum.
 

Archduke

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Hi Crysta,

I dont have much knowledge on the butterflies of Canada, but based on your experience, do the butterflies appear all year round? If so the chance of overwintering is quite low. Alternatively, you can keep it in your room or somewhere warmer to trick them into believing its still summer. I have also little knowledge about these habits (the asian butterflies here dont overwinter) but discussions have noted that they either do it at the larvae stage, where they take longer to pupate, or that they stay at their pupae stage longer.

Best Regards,
Mark
 

Crysta

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update!

so here we are, update!!

I have a bunch of teenagers now!! more still need to turn in chrysalis.. also, they are feeding generously on the store baught kale..!


and WOW amazing...I had a bunch of caterpillars eating veggie greens this morning, and 5 of them that were eating finished turning into the pupae form!!! wow!! such a quick process!

 
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