Mastering one's fears can be more challenging than one thinks.

LythSalicaria

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Hey all, I was going to post this in TWC, but it is related to inverts and I thought that it might be good discussion fodder. Not sure if this is going to be classified as fluff or not; if it is, sincere apologies.

Like so many here, I got into the hobby to help conquer my fear of "creepy crawlies". For the most part spiders were my biggest triggers, though large insects and centipedes could make me squeal pretty loud too. Since I've gotten into this, I've come a very long way. I've had a few escapes, 2 where I ended up with slings either crawling up my arm or down my leg, and I've handled those situations well. Stayed calm, held still, waited for them to stop running and then got them back in their homes quickly. Not posting this looking for pats on the back though. I'm posting this because it would seem that while I have indeed come a long way, I still have a bit of a way to go.

I was on the couch with my S.O. earlier watching Netflix, and I felt a crawling sensation on my leg. I checked where I had felt it, found nothing, figured it was just a random itch and returned my attention to the TV. A minute later, I glanced down and a big honking house centipede was casually strolling across my thigh! I don't think I've ever moved so fast in my life. I jumped to my feet and started spinning around in circles chanting, "Get it off!" like it was some sort of mantra, trying to figure out where the bloody thing was and finally punctuated my little spaz attack with, "Holy :poop: on a cracker!" as I ripped off my pants to ensure the transient stowaway was off of my person. The centipede got through the experience unscathed and is now living happily in my basement, and I think my S.O. peed himself a little from laughing, but the experience certainly made me stop and think. I am so, so glad that I followed the advice of those who told me to work my way up to advanced species. Yeah, I've got a couple of Psalmos and I used to have a P. regalis and a couple of H. gigas, but my experiences with all of them wasn't bad at all, even when I had to do rehousings. Researching the bag technique on here helped me a great deal when I was working with them. (Many thanks for that, AB!)

Regardless, this experience has given me even more reason to take my time. As interesting and beautiful as a lot of OW species appear to be, I'll be working my way up to them very slowly. I had plans to possibly try Ceratogyrus species in a year or so, but now I'm second-guessing myself. Beginning to think that it would be wise to wait several years until I'm positive that my fears are gone. I'm pretty sure that the main reason I reacted so badly to this incident is because I wasn't in any way prepared for it - hadn't even seen any of these centipedes in my house in over a year. Be that as it may, better to be safe than sorry. Any new additions I get for the foreseeable future will be those comparable in temperament and speed to the species I've already got.

So here's what I'm curious about: How do you go about testing yourself to see if your fears are under control without putting yourself or your animals in potential danger? Are there any other members who have had similar wake-up calls? Lastly, why do you think it is that so many people have this primal, deep-seeded fear of arachnids and insects?
 

BossRoss

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...Lastly, why do you think it is that so many people have this primal, deep-seeded fear of arachnids and insects?...
We don't. Children are taught from a young age that spiders and insects, some insects at least, are dangerous and we are warned to stay away from them- that's good parenting right?! I feel we should educate the children better, yes some creatures can be very dangerous but very often they are only dangerous when provoked or disturbed. Children are often smarter than we give them credit for.

I don't have any fears I know of and I am always willing to try any thing new twice, however I have had bad experiences which made me hesitant to do something again but as the old saying goes, "You have to get back onto the horse.". I am not dismissing a genuine fear of something but I do believe some people are just being over dramatic(no offence to anyone here and if you take offence put it back when you done:tongue:)

I think you are doing an awesome thing by trying to over come your fear and still maintaining the responsibility of a good T collector, so well done to you.
 

gobey

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We don't. Children are taught from a young age that spiders and insects, some insects at least, are dangerous and we are warned to stay away from them- that's good parenting right?! I feel we should educate the children better, yes some creatures can be very dangerous but very often they are only dangerous when provoked or disturbed. Children are often smarter than we give them credit for.

I don't have any fears I know of and I am always willing to try any thing new twice, however I have had bad experiences which made me hesitant to do something again but as the old saying goes, "You have to get back onto the horse.". I am not dismissing a genuine fear of something but I do believe some people are just being over dramatic(no offence to anyone here and if you take offence put it back when you done:tongue:)

I think you are doing an awesome thing by trying to over come your fear and still maintaining the responsibility of a good T collector, so well done to you.
Yeah I was never taught any of that.

Only to never touch the fireants. They suck.

But I used to cup bugs and the biggest spiders I could find in jars and let them out of the house after looking at them. I always wanted a tarantula.

I used to go catch snakes and lizards too. I was bitten an awful lot. Didn't stop me.

Luckily I never found a snake in FL that I shouldn't have messed with.


I got into snorkeling and marine life at a young age too. And in my early 20s began doing open water and caged shark dives. Not with like great whites or anything super big.... Yet... But I've swam up and down the coast with lots of species.

I just keep a healthy level of on edge and alert.

I stay confident with my Ts... But never overconfident...

That's helped me so far...

It's also influenced how I've decided to progress in my collection. I feel confident in myself. Knock on wood it's not my downfall.

But knowing yourself if you indeed have a fear or reservation... That's super important.


I'll say too after owning tarantulas for a while now... There's something that makes them less scary than true spiders. Especially NW terrestrial Ts. They're so big and goofy looking.

Regular spiders.... You don't even know they're there.
 

BossRoss

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Yeah I was never taught any of that.
Neither was I luckily. Many friends were and I was always the terrorist with bugs and what not. I also coached children for many years and the ones that were taught that were easily distinguishable between the ones that were.
 

Ellenantula

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I think you can relearn some reflexes.
I have taken a few bites off my macaw (esp when she was immature and didn't know she had pliers instead of lips) and my amazon parrot.
Like Ts, a parrot can die if you fling them and they hit the floor or wall hard. And those bites HURT like a (insert ugly words here) but you just have to be stoic, take the bite, and do not react by knocking them off your arm or shaking your arm to fling them off.
I think the secret is learning to freeze - think - plan.
Back in the eighties when I kept finches (guess they overlapped a bit into 1990s with my parrot keeping) if one got loose, I learned to recapture them by grabbing them mid-flight but not squeeze them to death -- just grab firmly enough to hold theirs wings to their body (so they can't flap their wings) but without just squeezing them to death. It was easier to wait until they landed somewhere, but same principle -- grip just firm enough to keep wings stabilized against body but not enough to crush the little dears.
Point: instinct dictates if I threw a ball at you, you catch it in a tight crushing grab -- but you can even retrain this response.
For most people, I like to think this can all be learned: calmness, gentleness and stillness.
Above all -- do no harm!
 
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Poec54

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why do you think it is that so many people have this primal, deep-seeded fear of arachnids and insects?
They don't. I used to give slide show talks on tarantulas to elementary schools and various groups back in the 1970's and early 1980's, with a live spider or two. The younger grades (2nd/3rd) were very open to tarantulas and few were afraid. By 4th/5th grade many had a fear of them, obviously it was conditioning from well-intentioned older children and adults, and no doubt the various media too. Also interesting was that overall, girls were braver than boys.
 

louise f

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They don't. I used to give slide show talks on tarantulas to elementary schools and various groups back in the 1970's and early 1980's, with a live spider or two. The younger grades (2nd/3rd) were very open to tarantulas and few were afraid. By 4th/5th grade many had a fear of them, obviously it was conditioning from well-intentioned older children and adults, and no doubt the various media too. Also interesting was that overall, girls were braver than boys.
I have been on schools with tarantulas too, and i have experienced the same as you, that the girls were braver than boys. That is in fact very interesting.
I got 2 sons the small one he is 13, he loves tarantulas, and all other animals as well, but the big son on 17 he hates tarantulas, but loves dogs and cats. Amazing what difference there is.
 

LythSalicaria

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Yeah I was never taught any of that.
So far as I can remember, I wasn't taught to fear them by my parents. They were more concerned about me messing with legitimate potential dangers such as snapping turtles, muskrats, raccoons, fishers and...this one might be a bit of a stretch...Pike. I fished a lot from spring to fall due to the fact that we had river-front property, and there was a small inlet that turned into swamp that I could easily cast my lures into. Hooked Pike with some regularity, and I was expected to always go and get my Dad when I caught one. Can somewhat understand why though - those teeth are no joke, especially once the fish reach larger sizes. But even when it came to those legitimate dangers, I didn't fear them, my parents just taught me to respect them and give them their space.

The media definitely might have had something to do with me developing my fear of bugs...that and a certain species of small black spider that seemed to live in the carpets in our house. When I went strolling across the carpeted sections of floor in bare feet I would end up accidentally squishing them between my toes and getting bitten in the process. For such small spiders they delivered a painful bite - comparable to being bitten by fire ants without the itchy, burning little welts. I've been trying to identify those spiders out of morbid curiosity but it's been a long time since I've been in that house, and I haven't seen them at all since I moved further South.

In response to those saying that these fears are learned or conditioned, that makes a great deal of sense. I also agree that it's entirely possible to recondition ourselves with dedication and a bit of effort. That bit Ellen said about learning to freeze, think and plan is sage wisdom, and it's what has allowed me to quickly recapture escapees.

gobey, what you said about Tarantulas being less intimidating than True Spiders rings true for me as well. I'd go so far as to call some of them cute. B. albopilosum, for instance. Wolf spiders, on the other hand...those still jeeb me out a bit, though I do find their behaviors fascinating. Y'know...from a distance. :giggle: Maybe that will be the next part of the "therapy" process for me - collect some local wolf spiders and see if I can get them to thrive in captivity. The process of working with them is bound to help.
 

gobey

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Lyth... Because the tarantula.... Odds are you know where it is (if it's an adult)

True spiders.... You don't see... And brown recluses are a real danger here.... Poecilotheria are not.

Well except in my room... But they're contained ;)

And there is something about the way tarantulas look... That just makes them.... Idk... Goofy...

Some OW are a little meaner looking or prettier...

But most are kind of staring at you with those clustered eyes that look like 2 big eyes giving you a doofy stare. And they walk funny. And they gobble up crickets like hungry hungry hippos... They clean themselves and do happy dances.

Horned baboons wear party hats...

:D
 

cold blood

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So far as I can remember, I wasn't taught to fear them by my parents. They were more concerned about me messing with legitimate potential dangers such as snapping turtles, muskrats, raccoons, fishers and...this one might be a bit of a stretch...Pike. I fished a lot from spring to fall due to the fact that we had river-front property, and there was a small inlet that turned into swamp that I could easily cast my lures into. Hooked Pike with some regularity, and I was expected to always go and get my Dad when I caught one. Can somewhat understand why though - those teeth are no joke, especially once the fish reach larger sizes. But even when it came to those legitimate dangers, I didn't fear them, my parents just taught me to respect them and give them their space.
Snappers have always interested me deeply. When I was a kid, I used to prowl the local ponds, reaching beneath the undercut banks searching for snappers, I used to be quite good at feeling them out, spinning them and pulling out by the tail...some really big suckers, too. That love still exists as I have a pair of young ones (one is 6 and the other 2) that I caught on their hatch day...6 years ago I happened upon a massive hatch on Halloween in a parking lot, they were getting killed left and right so I rescued 12, fattened them up and released them. The 2 year old was stepped on and smushed way down into a foot print in the firm mud....it had incurred damage, but after 6 months finally began to eat and is doing really well.

As for those pike, yeah you need to know how to handle them for sure...rows of teeth all razor sharp and pointed backwards to hold prey and some large canines as well, especially on the bottom jaw. Just look at those teeth!! But that's not what usually cause the damage, its the gill plate and rakers that cause serious damage to the uneducated handler. Since I can remember I have always been the designated musky/pike removal person in my family/group....oddly, the bigger they get, the easier they are to handle...and they do get quite large in the north, Canada is pike/musky paradise basically!!

They don't. I used to give slide show talks on tarantulas to elementary schools and various groups back in the 1970's and early 1980's, with a live spider or two. The younger grades (2nd/3rd) were very open to tarantulas and few were afraid. By 4th/5th grade many had a fear of them, obviously it was conditioning from well-intentioned older children and adults, and no doubt the various media too. Also interesting was that overall, girls were braver than boys.
I notice this as well. About 8 years ago when I moved into my current place, the girl next door was about 3 and her cousin 4, back then they asked almost daily if they could "see the piders", a few years ago that slowed and now they have not only lost interest in them, but now what once interested them is suddenly "creepy" and "weird"...learned behavior from classmates, without a doubt.

I also notice men acting much more squeamish (and embarrassing) when they see my t's than do women, who rarely freak out like many of the guys do...I still find it odd.
I ripped off my pants
Please, tell me more :biggrin:
 

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awiec

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I was never scared of spiders, I was just told to leave them be because they eat bugs and of course to leave a lone the rare black widow if one surfaced. Of course I did not listen, I kept a few widows in jars under my porch and I would catch and sell wolf spiders to the local pet store/bait shops but I made sure to leave a number of specimens around the house to re-populate for next year. Though my sisters had a very strange fear of inverts when they were small, I'm not sure where it came from as neither my mother nor step father really reacted badly to them, they would usually just catch them and put them outside. They have grown out of it and were even a bit sad to see my Ts go when I moved out. I think some people are just freaked out by small things that are fast. Though I know many people who aren't weirded out by tarantulas just because they do look "fluffy" and have a more calm and methodical movement to them.
 

ratluvr76

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I've never been afraid of spiders per se I just was worried about getting bitten and my reflexes are kind of slow. My focus when dealing with the local spiders has changed, I no longer have a concern of hurting them, my Ts have taught me slow and methodical will usually win out with arachnids. My dad used to name the house spiders and forbade my mother to kill them. He always knew where one had set up residence and let it live there indefinitely. At least for the ones that wouldn't roam once it had settled in.

I grew up in Alberta cold blood, dad and I would go pike fishing a lot. Dad was of the opinion that if you catch it, and intend to eat it you have to clean it yourself. He had warned me about the gil plates, but not the simply evil rows of teeth on the roofs of their mouths. At about eight yrs old, my first time ever cleaning one, a slippery little booger, I got the bright idea to pinch its nose with my fingers on top and my thumb in its mouth. OUCH! Don't do that have. My thumb was a raw mess for about 4 days. Thankfully he taught me to club it in the head first so it was dead already or it probably would have bit me pretty bad lol.

As far as phobias though..... mine is moths. I don't even want to feed wax worms because I know the turn into moths... >shudders<
 

mmfh

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I think if u want to condition a calmer reaction to things out of your control, go out in yhe woods and dig through rotting wood and under rocks and u get used to things you're not expecting running every which way. But be careful in areas that might have rattlesnakes and such. Good luck
 

cold blood

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I grew up in Alberta cold blood, dad and I would go pike fishing a lot. Dad was of the opinion that if you catch it, and intend to eat it you have to clean it yourself. He had warned me about the gil plates, but not the simply evil rows of teeth on the roofs of their mouths. At about eight yrs old, my first time ever cleaning one, a slippery little booger, I got the bright idea to pinch its nose with my fingers on top and my thumb in its mouth. OUCH! Don't do that have. My thumb was a raw mess for about 4 days. Thankfully he taught me to club it in the head first so it was dead already or it probably would have bit me pretty bad lol.

As far as phobias though..... mine is moths. I don't even want to feed wax worms because I know the turn into moths... >shudders<
Funny, I have a similar story about them....I handled them a lot and when disposing of the carcasses I was proud of myself that I figured out how to lip one (I was probably 9), even though it was dead. I got cocky and decided to toss it to an Eagle, via the lip hold...as I let it go, the top teeth nicked the top of my thumb and took every piece of flesh down to the base of the nail. This was over 30 years ago, I still don't have a cuticle at the base of my nail...scarred for life...lol.

I've had waxies around a bunch and last week I had the very first one turn into a moth when I left it in my t room for 2 consecutive days. Keep them cooler and it takes longer then your t's appetite will allow. Plus they kind of cacoon up beforehand, so they would be easy for you to pick out and either dispose of or feed out. Its easy to avoid moths....heck, I've been trying for months and have gotten 1 (I just keep them a little too cool, I think)...lol.
 

iligin

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I saw this thread earlier and was like "nah I'm not afraid of anything" but I just went to the bathroom and there was a cockroach, maybe 2 inches, sitting on the counter staring up at me and I squealed and jumped up and down and missed it with my shoe... so yeah I'm tough.
Honestly though roaches are it for me, and I need to get over that. It was definitely something I was taught from watching other people freak out about them when I was young.
 

awiec

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I saw this thread earlier and was like "nah I'm not afraid of anything" but I just went to the bathroom and there was a cockroach, maybe 2 inches, sitting on the counter staring up at me and I squealed and jumped up and down and missed it with my shoe... so yeah I'm tough.
Honestly though roaches are it for me, and I need to get over that. It was definitely something I was taught from watching other people freak out about them when I was young.
I am not fond of them because of several diseases they can carry but I do think dubia, hissers and giant cave roaches are pretty cool.
 

Ellenantula

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I think if u want to condition a calmer reaction to things out of your control, go out in yhe woods and dig through rotting wood and under rocks and u get used to things you're not expecting running every which way. But be careful in areas that might have rattlesnakes and such. Good luck
Good idea for becoming inured to creepy crawlies! Because the next time something suddenly appears on your arm, leg, whatever -- it might be that sling that went missing or an escapee because you forgot to latch a lid. You want to be able to find that immediate calm so you can assess the danger, if any, instead of squealing, knocking at it, flinging it to the floor.
Not that that might not be the right action (I don't know what creeps around your home!) but you do need to freeze, think, and plan in case it's a pet.
 

LythSalicaria

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Snappers have always interested me deeply. When I was a kid, I used to prowl the local ponds, reaching beneath the undercut banks searching for snappers, I used to be quite good at feeling them out, spinning them and pulling out by the tail...some really big suckers, too. That love still exists as I have a pair of young ones (one is 6 and the other 2) that I caught on their hatch day...6 years ago I happened upon a massive hatch on Halloween in a parking lot, they were getting killed left and right so I rescued 12, fattened them up and released them. The 2 year old was stepped on and smushed way down into a foot print in the firm mud....it had incurred damage, but after 6 months finally began to eat and is doing really well.
Between my dad's warnings/threats and the fact that a childhood friend lost half of her big toe to one, I was always a little too intimidated to get up close and personal with the big ones, but I loved watching them from a distance. Now that I think about it, with how many of them lived in that swamp I mentioned in my OP and how often I used to go wading through there looking for bullfrogs and water snakes, I'm lucky I didn't run into one by accident. Haha! That's so cool that you were able to rescue some babies, Dennis. I got the opportunity only once, when a 3 or 4 inch baby washed up on the riverside by our house with a cracked shell. I brought him inside and showed him to my parents and we ended up putting him in with our red-eared terrapins. They were roughly the same size, and much to our collective amazement they all got along pretty well. We kept him for about a year, he healed up and we released him the following spring. It was such a rewarding experience. :)

As for those pike, yeah you need to know how to handle them for sure...rows of teeth all razor sharp and pointed backwards to hold prey and some large canines as well, especially on the bottom jaw. Just look at those teeth!! But that's not what usually cause the damage, its the gill plate and rakers that cause serious damage to the uneducated handler. Since I can remember I have always been the designated musky/pike removal person in my family/group....oddly, the bigger they get, the easier they are to handle...and they do get quite large in the north, Canada is pike/musky paradise basically!!
My dad told me nothing about gill plates or rakers. Would have been nice to be informed. :p Thanks for the pics CB. :) Looks like you got yourself a nice catch there - do you eat the fish you catch or do you catch and release? I like to switch it up myself, also depends on what I catch, of course. I've always wanted to go fishing for Musky but I've never gotten the opportunity. Dad was going to take me when I got old enough, but...well...lets just say cancer's a [insert nasty expletive here].

I notice this as well. About 8 years ago when I moved into my current place, the girl next door was about 3 and her cousin 4, back then they asked almost daily if they could "see the piders", a few years ago that slowed and now they have not only lost interest in them, but now what once interested them is suddenly "creepy" and "weird"...learned behavior from classmates, without a doubt.

I also notice men acting much more squeamish (and embarrassing) when they see my t's than do women, who rarely freak out like many of the guys do...I still find it odd.
*resists urge to reference a certain schoolyard chant about girls' proclivity for taking command, and boys' tendency to salivate* ... :biggrin:

Seriously though, I've even noticed this when I have people over to visit. My little brother from another mother acts like I'm holding a live grenade when I try to show him a freshly molted sling. A SLING - not even one of my adults or subadults. LOL...meanwhile most of the women I've had over don't seem to have that problem...although one told me to get it away from her before she squished it. That got her on my :poop: list mighty quick. The only reason I showed it to her in the first place was because she thought Tarantulas were Salamanders.

Good idea for becoming inured to creepy crawlies! Because the next time something suddenly appears on your arm, leg, whatever -- it might be that sling that went missing or an escapee because you forgot to latch a lid. You want to be able to find that immediate calm so you can assess the danger, if any, instead of squealing, knocking at it, flinging it to the floor.
Not that that might not be the right action (I don't know what creeps around your home!) but you do need to freeze, think, and plan in case it's a pet.
This is exactly what I was thinking when I started this thread...what if that house centipede had been one of my slings? I'd probably be handing in my T-keeper card and slinking away with my tail between my legs. I'm obsessive about making sure enclosures are sealed, sometimes I even check them when I haven't been working with the Ts, but I'm bound to screw up sooner or later. It's human nature. This is why one of my questions was about ways to test myself without having to put anyone in harms way.

I think if u want to condition a calmer reaction to things out of your control, go out in yhe woods and dig through rotting wood and under rocks and u get used to things you're not expecting running every which way. But be careful in areas that might have rattlesnakes and such. Good luck
This right here, is a brilliant idea. Thank you mmfh! :D The only rattlesnakes we've got around here are Massasauga rattlers (Sistrurus catenatus), but I've been all over Ontario and never seen one. Kinda wish I could - from what I've seen in pictures they're quite pretty.
 

DVirginiana

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I've never been afraid of spiders or other creepy crawlies, but if something drops onto me out of nowhere or starts crawling up my leg when I'm not expecting it I'll still freak out. I'm an ecologist, and I think my assistant used to find it really amusing that I'd scream whenever a spider dropped on me in the woods but had tarantulas at home.

lol In my (somewhat limited) experience men are almost always more afraid of any of my exotics than women are. My husband won't even stay in the room when I'm feeding the T's. He'll kind of hide halfway out of the doorway if I try and get him to watch.
 

cold blood

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Between my dad's warnings/threats and the fact that a childhood friend lost half of her big toe to one, I was always a little too intimidated to get up close and personal with the big ones, but I loved watching them from a distance. Now that I think about it, with how many of them lived in that swamp I mentioned in my OP and how often I used to go wading through there looking for bullfrogs and water snakes, I'm lucky I didn't run into one by accident. Haha! That's so cool that you were able to rescue some babies, Dennis. I got the opportunity only once, when a 3 or 4 inch baby washed up on the riverside by our house with a cracked shell. I brought him inside and showed him to my parents and we ended up putting him in with our red-eared terrapins.



My dad told me nothing about gill plates or rakers. do you eat the fish you catch or do you catch and release? I like to switch it up myself, also depends on what I catch, of course. I've always wanted to go fishing for Musky but I've never gotten the opportunity.



*resists urge to reference a certain schoolyard chant about girls' proclivity for taking command, and boys' tendency to salivate* ... :biggrin: The only reason I showed it to her in the first place was because she thought Tarantulas were Salamanders.



This right here, is a brilliant idea. Thank you mmfh! :D The only rattlesnakes we've got around here are Massasauga rattlers (Sistrurus catenatus), but I've been all over Ontario and never seen one. Kinda wish I could - from what I've seen in pictures they're quite pretty.
Them snappers are tough, way to rehabilitate! It is nice to release them fat and healthy, the one pictured was the only one I didn't release or the 12, and that's just because the bugger is just so darn aggressive, really entertaining, also the one that most imprinted on the human form lurking overhead. It will swim right to anything moving and grab it...had to pull it off my hand once...hehe...jerk! I plan on releasing him somewhere safe down south when he outgrows my ability to provide a properly sized enclosure. I will say, in a typical situation in the water they are much less aggressive than on land, where most peoples aggressive experiences come from. They would usually rather hunker down or swim away then bite you while wading.



The rakers are basically the back of the gills, supporting the filaments, they are absolutely razor sharp, but normally only an issue if you are holding it by the gill plate (like I was in my pic)...its not something you do with smaller fish. There's just no room to maneuver in there on small ones without contacting the gill rakers. On large fish the danger is that many get their hand in there too deep, and while you hand can slide right through the gills, try to pull it back out or have the fish thrash and those rakers will stop you quick and cut you to the bone. The worst Esox (genus for musky and pike) injuries I've seen in my days all revolve around the gill rakers....and walleye and perch have nasty gill plates as well....all fish do really, but these tend to be especially annoying when handling large numbers of them. Often people don't even realize they were cut or what cut them when the gill plates get ya. . I've been cut enough times that I stopped even thinking about it.

You should definitely try to get a musky at some point. They are kind of a game changer in terms of North American sport fish, impressive in so many ways. I caught my first at 13, by 18 I had decided that all other species were to be ignored, I fished musky almost exclusively for a little over 15 years until about 10 years ago when I branched back to trout/salmon and bass(mainly). The arthritis musky fishing had helped move into my hands played a role, I won't lie. Musky fishing is a taxing thing to dedicate your life to, both mentally and physically...but the rewards...oh, they're worth it!!;)

I release 98% of the fish I catch, and 100% of all large or giant specimens, regardless of species. I keep small pike occasionally on lakes without size limits on them, maybe a few panfish a few times a year and maybe an incidental walleye, but generally I release everything. Watching them swim away is a big reward for me.

That massasauga is the only rattlesnake sp. in my area as well (actually not my area, west of me)...I managed to catch one once as a kid ad Devils Lake Park (Baraboo, WI), when I realized what I had I tossed I into the lake, where it swam back into the boulders I pulled him from. They're a pretty small snake and I believe a threatened species.

Salamanders, wow, that's a new one:/ Spectacularly hilarious:smile:

I taught my nephew that "adage" before he started school....boys rule, girls drool...is that the one you were recalling??
 
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