bones and vegetation?

BerleyQubed · Apr 9, 2015

I've been collecting bones for years now. I bleach them when I originally find them to clean off all of the decay. Last time was about 2 years ago, would it be safe to put those in the enclosure?

Also what kinds of plants are you using for your enclosure? What is your substrate made of? Do you use any bugs or worms to help with mold and cleaning?

The Snark · Apr 9, 2015

The chlorine is long gone. However, as a precaution I would rinse them thoroughly in running water to remove any salts that may remain. We all know how well plants grow in salt pans like Panamint, Salton sea, Death Valley, Bonneville etc.

You really need to be more specific as to what your enclosure is for. The possibilities are endless. From aquatic swamps to arid desert. I'd rule out sequoia species unless you want a terrarium filled with a root ball with a bonsai tuft on top.

Substrate choices are endless as well and the choice of animal(s) kept, ditto. Just keep the rule of thumb in mind, are you trying to create an in situ environment for a specific animal, a given climate or a self sustaining ecosystem.

Most people acquire an animal and go the in situ route. The most complex is creating an ecosystem then introducing an animal or animals that can adapt to the system. Creating a self sustaining detritus layer sends you into the world of micro-biology.

Rhiannonn · Apr 10, 2015

You can also use cold water maceration to clean the bones. Takes a while but no chemicals and great results.

The Snark · Apr 11, 2015

Rhiannonn said:
You can also use cold water maceration to clean the bones. Takes a while but no chemicals and great results.

You might want to procure a fume hood, SCBA-Self Contained Breathing Apparatus, or have a large yard and only distant neighbors with this process. But it does work very well and preserves cartilage best.
You can also use an ant nest but they destroy cartilage and small fragile bones.

truecreature · Apr 11, 2015

As far as the bones go, you should look into using hydrogen peroxide to whiten instead of the bleach. Bleach harms the quality of the bone, and if you combine that with boiling/simmering you've got a skull that can end up crumbling over the years.

The Snark · Apr 11, 2015

raisinjelly said:
As far as the bones go, you should look into using hydrogen peroxide to whiten instead of the bleach. Bleach harms the quality of the bone, and if you combine that with boiling/simmering you've got a skull that can end up crumbling over the years.

Unfortunately H2O2 causes cells to explode creating pockets and weaknesses. Doesn't look like humans are ever going to beat Mom Nature at this game.

truecreature · Apr 11, 2015

Huh, that's the first I've heard of that. In the skull cleaning community it's considered the gentlest way to whiten bone and nobody has ever reported any issues with it, even on very fragile specimens

The Snark · Apr 12, 2015

raisinjelly said:
Huh, that's the first I've heard of that. In the skull cleaning community it's considered the gentlest way to whiten bone and nobody has ever reported any issues with it, even on very fragile specimens

You are correct in part. Very dilute H2O2 and diligent cleaning is effective. The problem comes up in the chemical reaction seen in the foaming. It is a powerful oxidizer. That extra oxygen atom breaks loose violently, literally causing cells to explode. With more than about 10% H2O2 it is considered a hazardous corrosive material that can literally dissolve organic material. So the whitening process you are seeing is it tearing molecules apart, be they ordinary dirt or the calcium bearing cells of bone.
So using it is a balancing act. Limit it's 'cleaning' to surface dirt and avoid saturating the material.

If you want a little craziness in your life, get an ordinary beef or pork bone from a butcher, mechanically clean off all tissue then drop it in 50% H2O2. But, WEAR NITRILE GLOVES, CLOTHING PROTECTION AND A FULL FACE SHIELD! The splattering as it boils the bone will melt your clothes or take your skin off faster than you can say OUCH! Let it get done cooking, air dry it, and you will have a very clean white bone... that can be crushed to rubble with your bare hands.
This is why paleontologists don't use oxidizers.

BerleyQubed · Apr 17, 2015

Wow thanks for all the feedback guys, I have a little squirrel skull that I'd like to eventually put into my tarantulas enclosures. Also a few vertebrae and a few femurs, not sure what they belong to though. I didn't really read much on plant life though, anyone have any suggestions on what type of plants to start with, also what substrate should you use if your panting live plants.

The Snark · Apr 17, 2015

BerleyQubed said:
Wow thanks for all the feedback guys, I have a little squirrel skull that I'd like to eventually put into my tarantulas enclosures. Also a few vertebrae and a few femurs, not sure what they belong to though. I didn't really read much on plant life though, anyone have any suggestions on what type of plants to start with, also what substrate should you use if your panting live plants.

What animal do you want to put in there? Or are you even going to house animals? If you aren't going to house animals, perforate the bottom for drainage, lay down an inch thick layer of heavy gravel, cover the gravel with geo-textile material, then add whatever soil in whatever depth your plant choice requires. Depending on the plant, your soil can be anything from finely decomposed granite for cacti and some succulents all the way to ultra bioactive swamp mud for ferns and semi aquatic water plants. Your plant choice is limited to the plant kingdom on this planet.

vespers · Apr 19, 2015

BerleyQubed said:
I didn't really read much on plant life though, anyone have any suggestions on what type of plants to start with, also what substrate should you use if your panting live plants.

Like Snark mentioned, what tarantula species/animal are you interested in housing in a natural enclosure? Once we know that, its easier to give you specific advice based on the animal's native habitat/natural living conditions.

BerleyQubed · Apr 29, 2015

So far I have three little tarantulas, I won't start planting until they get a little larger, I'd just like to start researching so I know what I'm doing, I have an A. Calchodes, a GBB and an A. Geniculata

vespers · Apr 29, 2015

BerleyQubed said:
So far I have three little tarantulas, I won't start planting until they get a little larger, I'd just like to start researching so I know what I'm doing, I have an A. Calchodes, a GBB and an A. Geniculata

A. chalcodes and C. cyaneopubescens are both xeric species. Most live plants (even succulents and desert ones) with them would prove difficult to maintain due to the environments those tarantulas prefer and the needs of the plants. Now on the other hand, A. geniculata is a tropical climate species that would be fine in a more humid environment favorable to growing plants. However, one thing to consider is that genics are like bulldozers and may tear up plants/dig up an enclosure whenever it feels like doing so. Your best options would probably be hardy aroids (pothos, syngoniums, etc.) that might survive the abuse.

BerleyQubed · Apr 30, 2015

Thanks a lot, that's actually really helpful information <3

The Snark · Apr 30, 2015

There are several varieties of small ornamental plants that thrive on soil disruption. Your 8 legged bulldozers could assist in creating a miniature forest. Numerous cacti and succulents for a start that love to get knocked over, rooting wherever they upper parts touch the ground. I had a beautiful up and coming prickly pear that got mashed flat by a tree branch. Now I've got about 50 volunteers where it's corpse was. Remember, most cacti and succulents can easily be dwarfed.

BerleyQubed · May 1, 2015

That's actually pretty cool

If I lived in a warmer climate I'd love to try that out. I guess I could always get one of my littler smaller friends to do it for me

Jesusplant · May 4, 2015

Ya I tried a couple times to plant a pothos with my T. stirmi and each time she chopped it down in short order. But if the plant lives they do look great with live plants

BerleyQubed · May 4, 2015

lol, I think a few of mine may be okay with plants. I think it's really adorable when they don't like something.

bones and vegetation?

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