Avic versicolor questions

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
I'm gonna start off by saying I'm completely new to the hobby and I've been doing a bit of research about all kinds of Ts. A few people recommended A. versicolor as my first and my heart is set on getting on. I tried to look for as much information about them as I could. And I guess I'm a little overwhelmed with it all. I know about the higher humidity and good ventilation and that they're arboreal. I don't have any breeders in my area so I'd have to rely on an online source. The ones I've seen (and have good reputations from this forum) seem to only sell the slings.

So my questions are these:

1. What kind of enclosure should I use for a .75 inch sling?
2. Where can I get food small enough for them? (Also what should I feed them?)
3. Any advice for keeping a small T in general?

Thanks in advance!
 

cold blood

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,223
I'm gonna start off by saying I'm completely new to the hobby and I've been doing a bit of research about all kinds of Ts. A few people recommended A. versicolor as my first and my heart is set on getting on. I tried to look for as much information about them as I could. And I guess I'm a little overwhelmed with it all. I know about the higher humidity and good ventilation and that they're arboreal. I don't have any breeders in my area so I'd have to rely on an online source. The ones I've seen (and have good reputations from this forum) seem to only sell the slings.

So my questions are these:

1. What kind of enclosure should I use for a .75 inch sling?
2. Where can I get food small enough for them? (Also what should I feed them?)
3. Any advice for keeping a small T in general?

Thanks in advance!
I'll start by saying that a versi is a poor choice for a first t, especially a sling (I dunno where you heard that:()...just take some time to look at all the "my dead avic" threads (more often than not started by people newer to the hobby, but even by experienced keepers) and you'll quickly realize that while they may not ultimately be THAT difficult, they are clearly more sensitive to improper husbandry and one of the less forgiving species you could get....and this goes double for slings.

NW terrestrials like Brachypelma, Grammostola and the spiders currently residing in the Eauthalus genus are the best species to start out with amongst a few random others. Even some of the larger NW like Lasiodora, Nhandu and even Acanthoscurria are better choices than a versi sling IMO, and they are not ideal.

That said, you'll likely get what you have your heart set on...so:

1. A 16oz or 32 oz deli cup are your best choices IMO. You could go right to the 32 or start with the 16 to keep the t closer to the ground, and therefore its prey items for a few molts then go to the 32oz. Terrestrials can go in a 16oz till about 2-2.5".

2. They will eat anything they can take down, and finding food is not a difficult endeavor. Small crickets are just fine and readily available at most pet stores. Versicolors, even small slings tend to be good eaters that aren't shy about tackling their prey. Once they create a web tube so you have a platform for delivery (without escape), mealworms and wax worms are also good feeders....as are small roaches if you keep them or have an LPS that sells them. The same food items can be used with terrestrials. Slings can and will also readily take pre-killed prey or even scavenge cut up pieces, which is great when the prey items are a little too big.

3. Keep them warm and feed them regularly, like twice a week (once at minimum). For terrestrials make sure they have a little extra sub so they can burrow and a hide, for arboreals, a vertical piece of bark or wood, some fake plants for the t to use as anchor points (a happy avic makes a web home, do what you can to encourage this) and for both arboreal and terrestrials alike, add a small water dish (like the cap from a bottle of water) and a little moss to periodically moisten. For the versi, proper cross ventilation is far more important than is humidity, despite the popular theories out there on the net. Dry sub, with the water dish and a light dribble of water on the web weekly is all you need in terms of humidity control for a versi.....which leads to...

It seems like you did a lot of your research by going through the plethora of care-sheets available online....seems like a great way to familiarize yourself with husbandry....its not. As many of the species you find recommended for beginners out there on the net are also very poor choices...starting with species like this versi and the OBT are just not quality advice that newbies should be listening to. I recommend that you ignore all the stuff you've learned and start over. You found the right spot, spend a few days (or more) just going through all the threads here at AB, there's a ton of great, real world advice at your fingertips, from people actually keeping just about every single species available to us. Most of your questions have already been asked and answered over the years, but if you can't find the info, there's ALWAYS someone here at the ready to offer the best advice, and bad or mis-information is very quickly corrected on this site.

I'll also add that the local pet store is an even worse place to get your t info from, so be careful of what you may hear/be told when looking at the pet store t's or getting feeders....they are generally highly misinformed and just looking to sell you things to increase their bottom line...useless things like heat pads/rocks/lamps, hygrometers, bark chip substrate, sponges for the water dishes, water gels, screen tops, etc., are just a taste of the useless things some people try to tell newbies are critical for the safe keeping of their t.

Best of luck with your first t, whatever it ends up being and welcome to the hobby....its endlessly fascinating.

---------- Post added 04-12-2015 at 01:24 AM ----------

And online is generally the best way to make your purchases, you will find a significantly larger selection and if you look in the right places, significantly lower prices. Make sure you check out the AB classified section....lots of smaller dealers and private breeders that will give you good, and sometimes fantastic deals compared with not only a pet store, but also with many of the larger online dealers.
 

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
Thanks for the response! I made a post on reddit asking what species they would recommend. I got recommended C. cyaneopubescens, Acanthoscurria geniculata, Avicularia versicolor, Lasiodora parahybana, Chilean Rose Hair, and Curly hair. Quite a few people suggested A. versicolor. But... I'd rather play it safe and get one that is definitely suited for a beginner. I guess I should ask what specific species you would recommend? I've already heard the advice about avoiding pet stores and I really don't trust the ones in my area.
 

cold blood

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,223
Thanks for the response! I made a post on reddit asking what species they would recommend. I got recommended C. cyaneopubescens, Acanthoscurria geniculata, Avicularia versicolor, Lasiodora parahybana, Chilean Rose Hair, and Curly hair. Quite a few people suggested A. versicolor. But... I'd rather play it safe and get one that is definitely suited for a beginner. I guess I should ask what specific species you would recommend? I've already heard the advice about avoiding pet stores and I really don't trust the ones in my area.
I don't go on reddit, but obviously its not the place to go....the only species recommended for a beginner that I agree with is the curly hair, its probably one of the best choices you could make. They're not typically defensive, not prone to bolting or even spooking, yet they are very active (which you'll want for your first) and have an excellent feeding response and are very easy to keep as they will do well in a wide range of environments, making them extremely forgiving. They also don't grow ultra-slow (one of, if not the fastest grower in the Brachypelma genus), like many of the other good beginner t's, but they also don't grow like weeds to large sizes in no time like an LP or A. genic.

I don't like GBB for beginners because of their speed and skittish nature, which I don't think is what most beginners need IMO. Their heavy webbing can also make general maintenance more than it needs to be when starting out. The plus is they are easy to keep, hardy and beautiful, but I don't think these are attributes should be looking for in a first t....pretty colors get people into trouble too often as it is, most t's are, indeed hardy and not really that difficult to keep once you get standard husbandry experience. While I wouldn't call them good firsts, they'd be a great second or third.

The Genic and LP, like the GBB, are better suited (IMO) as a second or third, simply because they a)grow very fast, faster than it will probably take you to get used to it as you could have a pretty big t in a year or even less. Also b)they are bolder and their feeding response is EXTREMELY strong, meaning you're likely to be dealing with a big t battle charging your tongs when doing basic husbandry on a regular basis. This can be intimidating for many people, especially those new to the hobby...for this reason I don't recommend either for a first t. Both t's that will always be around and cheap, no hurry.

Rosehairs are just boring, known as pet rocks, are inactive, very, very slow growing, have probably the worst feeding response in the t world and the highest propensity for fasting as well (as long as a year or more with a month not even being long enough to constitute a fast). And while when they are "on", their feeding response can be great, they just shut down for extended periods of time on an all too regular basis...which causes beginners to over-feed when they are "on" and worry over nothing when they are "off". They don't really burrow and have long periods of inactivity. I've had one for 15 years, love it, but its by far the most boring t I have;). They also, for some reason still have this reputation as a calm, gentle spider, which isn't actually the norm. Its about 50/50 whether you get a nice one or a psycho, even then, their demeanors are notorious for changing following a molt, going from little sweethearts to monsters over night. There are more threads started by newbies worrying over nothing about their rosehair than probably all other species combined.




Ones I like are Eauthalus sp. red/yellow, and parvula, all calm, inquisitive with an almost reluctance to defend themselves with hairs or fangs. Owners of them almost universally have a strong fondness for them. The downside is they grow really slow, the plus is that they're not too expensive and you can generally locate juvenile or sub adult females at reasonable costs. Often described as the "best" true beginner species.

Thrixopelma cyaneolum is also one of the best. They're a gorgeous blue, easy to keep, exceptionally docile, great eaters, but I won't spend too much time here as actually finding one correctly identified is not an easy task here in the states. It may be the best beginner t I've ever seen, at least as good as the above Eauthalus.

Brachypelma smithi, emelia, vagans, albo (curlyhair). All grow slowers, with vagans and albo being generally much faster. The other 2 are hit or miss I think, as many complain of painfully slow growth, but my smithi went from 1-3.5" in the first year, so you're not damned to slow growth. They all have a good disposition (vagans can be the most defensive). All have a decent to great feeding response (there are certainly exceptions) and are good looking with tendencies to be visible, especially as they age. Smithi and emelia are especially attractive, vagans and albo are probably the busybodies or the genus, constantly doing construction of sorts.

Grammostola pulchra is a splendid t, with a great disposition, moderate, but bulky size, good feeding response and jet black coloration. There's more than a few that label this as their favorite t or the best beginner t on the planet and they have an almost cult following amongst many....and its cousin G. pulchripes is another classic choice, very beautiful, very much like the genic and lp in ways, but with a calmer general disposition. While they share that super food aggression (with genic/LP), they are not difficult to deal with and generally retreat quickly upon realizing their mistake, but they also grow at a much slower pace, which will really give you a lot more time to get comfy with it as it grows. Under-rated in terms of beauty for sure and a t that actually continues to look better and better with each molt as they get bigger. I love these spiders, mine had to go recently, he's in Chicago checking out the club scene, word has it he's already popular with the ladies there:wink:

All of these are exceptionally easy to keep and very hardy.
 

Hydrazine

Arachnobaron
Old Timer
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
411
I feel like avic (versi) being a poor first choice T is a myth, I managed to not kill my tiny versi sling as a genuine newbie, and I actually found it quite sturdy. (s)he's now over 2.5" and happily munching the exuvia so I still have no clue about the actual gender.

It's this myth itself that kills the Avics. Death from overcaring and overthinking the care of supposedly fragile species. That further reinforces the myth and makes even experienced keepers believe it.
People smothering them in tiny vials that can't be balanced between humidity and ventilation is another huge factor.
 

Angel Minkov

Arachnobaron
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
595
Two words - G. pulchra. In my opinion, the best starter tarantula, along with B. smithi and OBTs/Pokies (hehe, just joking ;) ). You won't regret getting a G. pulchra or B. smithi, trust me ;)
 

lalberts9310

Arachnoprince
Joined
Oct 9, 2014
Messages
1,083
Species from the following genera: aphonopelma, grammastola (try to avoid rosea and porteri, unless you want a moody spider that fasts for months on end), brachypelma, euathalus and eupalaestrus.. great beginner Ts

I agree that avicularia isn't the best genus to start with, most beginners find it difficult to care for them, they are very sensitive when it comes to husbandry.

---------- Post added 04-12-2015 at 10:40 PM ----------

I feel like avic (versi) being a poor first choice T is a myth, I managed to not kill my tiny versi sling as a genuine newbie, and I actually found it quite sturdy. (s)he's now over 2.5" and happily munching the exuvia so I still have no clue about the actual gender.

It's this myth itself that kills the Avics. Death from overcaring and overthinking the care of supposedly fragile species. That further reinforces the myth and makes even experienced keepers believe it.
People smothering them in tiny vials that can't be balanced between humidity and ventilation is another huge factor.
That's exactly the point, as most newbies follow "care sheets" from other sites thus overcaring for them.. why they aren't a great genus to start with, most threads I have seen here regarding the death of an avic is due to poor husbandry by a newbie who followed online "care sheets".
 

Sana

Arachnoprince
Joined
Oct 26, 2014
Messages
1,139
I'm gonna have to agree with CB on this one. He has offered a wealth of information between his posts and all of it the same that I would offer someone new to the hobby. I got an Avicularia as my second tarantula. I honestly wanted one as my first, but I'm glad now that I waited. I was a helicopter keeper with my first tarantula and no doubt would have cared an avic to death without some experience.
 

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
I might go with G. pulchripes due to cost and color. Also thanks to your recommendations. Do you know of a good care sheet out there? Or is there a thread somewhere I can read about how to take care of them? I've already looked at different online dealers and the slings vary in size from 1/4" to 1". Any recommendations for me?

Sorry for so many questions. I just want to know what to do!
 

Sana

Arachnoprince
Joined
Oct 26, 2014
Messages
1,139
My first was a G. pulchripes. I got him when he was 1/2". Honestly if I'd known then what I do now, I'd have gotten a little bigger one to start with. Any old way you go about it, deli cups make an excellent home for a spider under 2". G. pulchripes are a terrestrial species so they need more width than height. I keep mine on plain old topsoil that is completely dry. He has a hide and deep enough substrate that he can make a little burrow if he chooses to. He's not a picky eater and he doesn't grow as slowly as I thought he would by what I had read. I keep all my tarantulas 74-80F with a bowl of fresh clean water. I took up using soda bottle caps for slings as many here suggest and it works well. I love my pulchripes though he is occasionally a bit moody.
 

Angel Minkov

Arachnobaron
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
595
I might go with G. pulchripes due to cost and color. Also thanks to your recommendations. Do you know of a good care sheet out there? Or is there a thread somewhere I can read about how to take care of them? I've already looked at different online dealers and the slings vary in size from 1/4" to 1". Any recommendations for me?

Sorry for so many questions. I just want to know what to do!
It's fine and actually admirable that you're doing your research through and through before plunging into the abyss that is T keeping. I don't know about G. pulchripes, but I'm willing to bet their husbandry is identical to the other representatives of the genus. I keep my G. pulchra in a 32 oz deli cup with 1,5'' of slightly moist coco fibre, some sphagnum moss and a water bowl. I feed it roaches, crickets and mealworms.
 

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
Thanks for the tips, Sana! I think I have most of the information I need. Found a good dealer that also sells 32 and 16 oz deli cups along with 1" G. pulchripes slings. I guess the only thing now is to wait to get enough money and learn how to best take care of them.
 

AbraCadaver

Arachnoknight
Old Timer
Joined
Feb 6, 2009
Messages
296
As someone who fell in love with Avics and bought a ton of them when I was a newbie, I think you've made the right choice. I love Avics, but if I could do it all again, I would have saved myself the hearthache my inexperience cost me.

So, good luck with your G.pulchripes baby, and welcome to the hobby!
 

SpiderInTheBath

Arachnosquire
Joined
Jan 7, 2015
Messages
62
I just got my A. versicolor as a second (along with my third, fourth, and fifth) and let me tell you: I was neurotic to the point of absurdity with my first (G. pulchripes). She probably has nightmare visions of my giant face just hovering there night after night, sometimes with a torch and shiny tongs poised at the ready. I think she now deliberately waits until I'm not looking to eat. My eyeballs would dry out waiting for it to happen.

I was totally heart set on getting A. versicolor too, and nearly didn't because I read all the dead threads about it and was convinced my air holes would be insufficient, that I would mist it to death, that I wouldn't be present to perform tiny spider CPR, etc. So far it's alive and eating healthily, and I'm nowhere near the wreck I was with the first one. Touch wood. Oh God. Maybe I should check on itjkdhbfjdkslkdjfhgb

Anyway.

Personally knowing how I felt before and how I do now I'd second waiting a bit -- I totally understand only wanting one, and wanting THAT one, but it is good advice.

Also: G. pulchripes is a great choice!
 

cold blood

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,223
Thanks for the tips, Sana! I think I have most of the information I need. Found a good dealer that also sells 32 and 16 oz deli cups along with 1" G. pulchripes slings. I guess the only thing now is to wait to get enough money and learn how to best take care of them.
Now I don't know how much the dealer is selling the delis for, it could be super-cheap for all I know....but you can easily get them at delis (I get mine from the deli inside Pick n' Save), restaurant supply stores (which are surprisingly abundant) or even online at places like amazon for really cheap costs. Like a 200 pack for under $2. The deli I go in just gives them to me, they say they wouldn't even know how to charge me for something that costs them next to nothing. And its not like I go in to get for one or two.
 

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
The site charges $1 for a 16 oz container and $1.50 for a 32 oz. I don't think that is going to be a problem since I'm only getting one T. If I were to get more, though, I'd probably go bargain shopping. But as it stands, I don't have a use for so many plastic containers. (The site is captiveinverts.com by the way)
 

cold blood

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,223
The site charges $1 for a 16 oz container and $1.50 for a 32 oz. I don't think that is going to be a problem since I'm only getting one T. If I were to get more, though, I'd probably go bargain shopping. But as it stands, I don't have a use for so many plastic containers. (The site is captiveinverts.com by the way)
Are they pre-ventilated?
 

Sana

Arachnoprince
Joined
Oct 26, 2014
Messages
1,139
I just save old tupperware, deli cups, and various size of plastic jars for mine. Cheapest containers ever since I was going to eat what was in them to begin with. Beware though, tarantula keeping long term can make you feel a bit like a hoarder. I have empty plastic containers by the stack just waiting for inhabitants.
 

Azulupei

Arachnopeon
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
15
I don't have any laying around, sadly. But I can go to a local supermarket and see if they'd let me have a 32 oz cup for the G. pulchripes.
 
Top