Phormicoptus sp. "Green"?

I'm a relatively new keeper (since January of this year) and I am sticking to NW tarantulas for the foreseeable future. That said, I'm still interested in graduating to more challenging species to keep, and I was wondering if anyone had any first hand information about keeping this one. Am I right to presume that the temperament will be similar (or identical) to what I'm reading about P. cancerides?

I LOVE the Phormictopus genus and I'm currently trying to snatch up all species currently available (and I just received my Phormictopus sp. greens yesterday). Husbandry-wise, I keep them all similarly. Slings will burrow, so I give them deep, moist substrate to allow for them to do their thing. The 1" slings I just bought are in 16 oz deli cups at the moment; they will likely outgrow these enclosures in a molt or two. As they get older, I give them more of a terrestrial setup with a hide, a few inches of substrate, and a water dish. I used to be much more careful to keep the substrate moist, but I've found that I really don't need to fixate on it. I'll moisten down a corner of the enclosure occasionally, but I'll let it dry out in between.

They are voracious eaters and the amount of growth between molts is quite impressive. Kept warm and fed well, you can have a good-sized tarantula in no time. Because of this, I usually give them larger enclosures when it comes time to rehouse the juveniles because they quickly grow out of them. Phormictopus species are one of my favorites to feed because of just how ruthless they are when they go after prey, and they have no problem tackling and subduing crickets their size.

I've found them all to be quite similar in temperament; I've never had one flick hairs, but I have had a few threat postures. Because of their impressive feeding instinct, they will also charge and attack anything that touches their substrate, which can make maintenance a bit of an adventure. If startled, they can also be quite nasty; I had one attack a molt I was trying to pull from the enclosure to sex, and it didn't let go for an hour. Still, a little caution goes a long way, and more often than not I can feed them without incident. Our of all the ones I keep, my trio of Phormictopus sp. purples are my most defensive, much more so than the four cancerides I keep.

Phormictopus are known for being feisty, however, and they can move quite fast for larger tarantulas, so I could see someone new to the hobby (or one used to working with slower, calmer New Worlds) might be intimidated. Still, they are hardy as all get out and have spunky personalities. Personally, I find them to be on par with the ever-popular L. parahybana, but with a bit more attitude.

Phormictopus sp. are amazing Theraphosidae. The care is the same (at least that's what i've done with no issues) temperament of course differs but we are talking about Phormictopus sp. so it's normal to expect a bit of defensive behavior

On a personal note (not talking about you OP) would be great if, following the "step by step" way of things, before buying OBT'S and other potent venom OW'S, people (not completely beginners of course) could spend some years dealing with those and the like of Ephebopus sp. etc

I think that Phormictopus sp. Ephebopus sp. along with Psalmopoeus sp. experience are the perfect ticket for work fine with OW'S after.

I've spent two decades working with those T's (25 years almost on January 2016, my "T" story: 2 years with beginners, very annoying but they are lovely as well 20 with those, and the last three with OW'S).

Only bad thing is (here at least in Italy, "No T Land") that Phormictopus sp. aren't cheap, but somewhat high priced, not like a Theraphosa sp. of course, but way more than the past.

Chris LXXIX said:

...Only bad thing is (here at least in Italy, "No T Land") that Phormictopus sp. aren't cheap, but somewhat high priced, not like a Theraphosa sp. of course, but way more than the past.

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What do they go for in Italy? The P. cancerides is quite cheap here, but I've seen some of the other species of Phormictopus and color variants go for a bit more. One vendor had sp. green slings for around $90.

Thanks guys, both for your enthusiasm and the detailed responses -- I'm in no rush at the moment, just poking around looking for a direction to move in, and it sounds like these spiders will be a good step up when the time comes. I'm not interested in handling or messing unnecessarily with mine, so something big and fun to watch feeding is definitely of interest! I also really like the idea of growing one up from a sling, so your advice about rehousing was valuable.

Because of their impressive feeding instinct, they will also charge and attack anything that touches their substrate, which can make maintenance a bit of an adventure. If startled, they can also be quite nasty; I had one attack a molt I was trying to pull from the enclosure to sex, and it didn't let go for an hour. Still, a little caution goes a long way, and more often than not I can feed them without incident. Our of all the ones I keep, my trio of Phormictopus sp. purples are my most defensive, much more so than the four cancerides I keep.

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^^ maybe pop back into this thread in a while and let me know how the greens compare!

SpiderInTheBath said:

Thanks guys, both for your enthusiasm and the detailed responses -- I'm in no rush at the moment, just poking around looking for a direction to move in, and it sounds like these spiders will be a good step up when the time comes. I'm not interested in handling or messing unnecessarily with mine, so something big and fun to watch feeding is definitely of interest! I also really like the idea of growing one up from a sling, so your advice about rehousing was valuable.



^^ maybe pop back into this thread in a while and let me know how the greens compare!

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You're most welcome and I sure will.

Tomoran said:

What do they go for in Italy? The P. cancerides is quite cheap here, but I've seen some of the other species of Phormictopus and color variants go for a bit more. One vendor had sp. green slings for around $90.

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Theraphosa sp. Phormictopus sp. Megaphobema sp. Pamphobeteus sp. here are very priced Theraphosidae.
Probably in USA was/is more easy (obviously due to short distance) to have lots of WC Phormictopus sp. from Haiti etc
Here those are CB.

Theraphosa sp. 100% sexed females (not slings) here cost like a brand new bundle game PS4. A no way for me.
Since in 2003 Italian government put a total ban on arachnids (now seems that things are just a bit better) you go figure.. some speculation was normal.

However you said a sling of those for 90$? Well, more than here here i can buy an adult female for 68 Euro.

Just that IMO are too high as well, when i started the hobby prices were more fair. I'm a chep skate??? :-/

lol

Chris LXXIX said:

Theraphosa sp. Phormictopus sp. Megaphobema sp. Pamphobeteus sp. here are very priced Theraphosidae.
Probably in USA was/is more easy (obviously due to short distance) to have lots of WC Phormictopus sp. from Haiti etc
Here those are CB.

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The distance really doesn't have much to do with whats available to us ( with the exception of native Aphonopelma). If country is open and they are available for export, its just as easy to obtain them over there as it is here, its just a couple more hours on a plane. I'm sure you have just as many WC T. stirmi and rose hairs there no ? All of our captive bred Pamphobetues, Megaphobemas etc ... all come from Europe, not south America.

Later, Tom

Philth said:

The distance really doesn't have much to do with whats available to us ( with the exception of native Aphonopelma). If country is open and they are available for export, its just as easy to obtain them over there as it is here, its just a couple more hours on a plane. I'm sure you have just as many WC T. stirmi and rose hairs there no ? All of our captive bred Pamphobetues, Megaphobemas etc ... all come from Europe, not south America.

Later, Tom

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Here are as well (all T's i mean) CB from neighbour European nations (with few exceptions, ok, but the % is laughable compared to others).

Tought that, being USA hobby a giant one (at least compared to Italy, where, prior to the 2003 arachnid ban, don't know if back then here were more than 500 enthusiasts) you got a lot of those WC due to an higher supply and demand factor, during years.

SpiderInTheBath said:

Thanks guys, both for your enthusiasm and the detailed responses -- I'm in no rush at the moment, just poking around looking for a direction to move in, and it sounds like these spiders will be a good step up when the time comes. I'm not interested in handling or messing unnecessarily with mine, so something big and fun to watch feeding is definitely of interest! I also really like the idea of growing one up from a sling, so your advice about rehousing was valuable.



^^ maybe pop back into this thread in a while and let me know how the greens compare!

Click to expand...

My sp Purple is more of a coward than anything, though he will fly out of the cage if he is startled too much. On the other hand my Pamphos will charge and thump whenever I need to do something in their cage.

i just purchased a sp green from petcenterusa, cant wait

awiec said:

My sp Purple is more of a coward than anything, though he will fly out of the cage if he is startled too much. On the other hand my Pamphos will charge and thump whenever I need to do something in their cage.

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It has nothing to do with courage. It has everything to do with the level of predation in their native habitat.

Poec54 said:

It has nothing to do with courage. It has everything to do with the level of predation in their native habitat.

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I was replying to the fact that someone posted an excerpt saying that sp Purple is extremely defensive compared to the rest of the genus. "Coward" was the wrong word to use but I was adding in my experience with the species as my specimen is very skittish compared to my other large South American terrestrials whom are more "confrontational". I don't like word nitpicking but I chose the words I did to illustrate my point ie specimens don't adhere to the generalizations we put on them.

awiec said:

I was replying to the fact that someone posted an excerpt saying that sp Purple is extremely defensive compared to the rest of the genus. "Coward" was the wrong word to use but I was adding in my experience with the species as my specimen is very skittish compared to my other large South American terrestrials whom are more "confrontational". I don't like word nitpicking but I chose the words I did to illustrate my point ie specimens don't adhere to the generalizations we put on them.

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It's like someone calling us a coward because we'd rather run and hide, than take on a 100' tall Godzilla with our bare hands. Tarantulas are as defensive/confrontational as they need to be, in order to survive in their habitats. Some predators strike fast and a spider may have a split second to defend itself. That doesn't mean they're brave when they immediately stand up in a defensive pose; it just means their best chance of survival is to respond quickly. We've all seen NW terrestrials that simply kick hairs and don't otherwise seem overly concerned by our intrusions. Obviously those hairs will keep most of their predators at bay. But the frequency of predator encounters, and their determination can require that other measures be taken. With fast-striking predators, there may not be time to kick hairs and let a cloud of them form a defensive perimeter. Options then instantly become fight or flight. When they stand with fangs out, it's not courage, it's fear for their lives. The ones that didn't do that were removed from the gene pool. Regardless of what method they choose, they use what has worked for them for thousands of years in the wild. To suddenly come face-to-face with a mongoose, honey badger, baboon/monkey, coati, large bird, centipede, etc has to be a terrifying experience for a tarantula.

If we're going to nitpick words, Tarantulas or tarantula like spiders have been around and evolving for MILLIONS of years.

awiec said:

I was replying to the fact that someone posted an excerpt saying that sp Purple is extremely defensive compared to the rest of the genus. "Coward" was the wrong word to use but I was adding in my experience with the species as my specimen is very skittish compared to my other large South American terrestrials whom are more "confrontational". I don't like word nitpicking but I chose the words I did to illustrate my point ie specimens don't adhere to the generalizations we put on them.

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Just to be clear, I posted that out of the six species of Phormictopus I keep, MY species purples are the most defensive. I wasn't generalizing the temperaments of the entire species, but only stating my observations on their behaviors. Temperament obviously varies from specimen to specimen. I also didn't use "extremely" either, as I wouldn't characterize the temperament of any of the 18 Phormictopus specimens I keep to be extremely defensive. Skittish and feisty at times with great feeding responses, but none are extremely defensive.

Just didn't want my comments to be misunderstood.

Tomoran said:

Just to be clear, I posted that out of the six species of Phormictopus I keep, MY species purples are the most defensive. I wasn't generalizing the temperaments of the entire species, but only stating my observations on their behaviors. Temperament obviously varies from specimen to specimen. I also didn't use "extremely" either, as I wouldn't characterize the temperament of any of the 18 Phormictopus specimens I keep to be extremely defensive. Skittish and feisty at times with great feeding responses, but none are extremely defensive.

Just didn't want my comments to be misunderstood.

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I was just throwing in my observations for good measure, I'm certainly interested in other people's experience as I only know a handful of people who have them. It got all bogged down in word play which I should not have bothered with in the first place.

awiec said:

I was just throwing in my observations for good measure, I'm certainly interested in other people's experience as I only know a handful of people who have them. It got all bogged down in word play which I should not have bothered with in the first place.

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Oh, no problem at all! I just didn't want my post to come across like I was making a generalization about all purples. I've just found that mine have an extra bit of attitude when compared to the other Phormictopus sp. I keep. My four cancerides are all quite well-behaved overall, and I don't think I've ever had a hair flicked or a threat posture from them.