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Is there any correlation between size and intellect? Are larger growing species also getting the benefit of increased brain size? Or is the bigger factor due to what type of species it is?
Any truth to bigger size = more intelligence?
- Thread starter Tyrannosaur
- Start date
i have no clue, althought just logically think, an elephant is dumber than us i guess
(at least some of us) hahaha I have no clue on that but if its only within a specie i think it wouldnt matter also becauz u have taller/bigger ppl than urself that also can have less inteligence (IQ or QI or smthin, i'm confused becauz of my language)..
//Tiago
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The size of the T does not make a difference as far as intelligence is concerned, imo
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There's practically no correlation, not just with T's but with all animals. Most T's seem to have roughly the same intelligence, regardless of size. Perhaps arboreals and burrowers are a little smarter than ones that just sit out in the open, but again there is no correlation between arboreal/burrowing behavior and size, and any difference in intelligence is very small.
To the best of my knowledge, the smartest known spiders are jumping spiders, which are very small compared to Ts.
In general, animals with the same brain size can have vastly different intelligence, or animals with very different brain sizes can have the same intelligence. Overall there is some upper limit to the intelligence of an animal based on it's brain size, but the complexity and "wiring" of the brain plays a much more important role that its mass.
To the best of my knowledge, the smartest known spiders are jumping spiders, which are very small compared to Ts.
In general, animals with the same brain size can have vastly different intelligence, or animals with very different brain sizes can have the same intelligence. Overall there is some upper limit to the intelligence of an animal based on it's brain size, but the complexity and "wiring" of the brain plays a much more important role that its mass.
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agreed ants have small to no brains
(just nerves?)
and they can act as a whole with little to no communication
my dog is huge and hes a complete moron
i give him a chew bone
and what does he do?
he chews on sticks and actually swallows them:wall:
i dont think theres a strong correlation IMO
(just nerves?)
and they can act as a whole with little to no communication
my dog is huge and hes a complete moron
i give him a chew bone
and what does he do?
he chews on sticks and actually swallows them:wall:
i dont think theres a strong correlation IMO
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Many factors apply, one being the ratio brain mass vs body mass. That means that a creature whose brain is the same mass than an human brain but whose body weights a ton would logically be less intelligent. When it comes to animals, other factors differ, like what proportion of the brain mass is made of connected neurons, is there any grey matter or the whole brain is only made of
nerves intersections and nods? In this regard inverts are way less endowed.
Finally, another key factor is how this brain is stimulated from the outside. Take two humans identical twins, have one live in a cell with no book or interaction or stimulus and you'll see that he won't measure up in any aspect to the one who grew up normally. Because of this, I would have a tendency to say that burrower Ts might be less stimulated since there is little intellectual stimulation when 90% of the living time is spent at the bottom of a tunnel where nothing occurs. On the other hand, an arboreal T has way more to deal with by simply wandering in the branches of a tridimensionnal tree, trying to analyse air movement to figure out if it's only a breeze or an airborne predator comming... none of this making them really intelligent though...
nerves intersections and nods? In this regard inverts are way less endowed.
Finally, another key factor is how this brain is stimulated from the outside. Take two humans identical twins, have one live in a cell with no book or interaction or stimulus and you'll see that he won't measure up in any aspect to the one who grew up normally. Because of this, I would have a tendency to say that burrower Ts might be less stimulated since there is little intellectual stimulation when 90% of the living time is spent at the bottom of a tunnel where nothing occurs. On the other hand, an arboreal T has way more to deal with by simply wandering in the branches of a tridimensionnal tree, trying to analyse air movement to figure out if it's only a breeze or an airborne predator comming... none of this making them really intelligent though...
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A correlation is observed with brain mass/body mass ratio. Elephants have bigger brains than humans, however, their brain/body mass ratio is lower. Of course, here we have to compare mammals with mammals, pmphibians with amphibians, and spiders with spiders. Maybe a jumping spider will have a higher ratio than humans, but their brain structure is waaaay different, wich makes us the best ;P
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There is absolutely no correlation between size and intelligence.
Firstly, 'intelligence' is notoriously hard to measure. Do you mean problem solving ability? Do you mean planning? Do you mean capacity for emotion? Do you mean... well... what do you mean?
Secondly, size of brain IS correlated with size of body... but not 'proportionately'. By that, I mean that it's normally the little bit at the back of the brain, the cerebellum, which is the best correlated with size (that's a generalisation, but I'm running with it). The reason for this is because the cerebellum is involved with coordination and movements.
Thirdly, it's thought, as far as I am aware, that brain folds are the best measure of brain power - almost like surface area is important.
So, in short, no, there's nothing to it.
Firstly, 'intelligence' is notoriously hard to measure. Do you mean problem solving ability? Do you mean planning? Do you mean capacity for emotion? Do you mean... well... what do you mean?
Secondly, size of brain IS correlated with size of body... but not 'proportionately'. By that, I mean that it's normally the little bit at the back of the brain, the cerebellum, which is the best correlated with size (that's a generalisation, but I'm running with it). The reason for this is because the cerebellum is involved with coordination and movements.
Thirdly, it's thought, as far as I am aware, that brain folds are the best measure of brain power - almost like surface area is important.
So, in short, no, there's nothing to it.
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Also what these guys said (we were all writing at about the same time!):
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damn, you beat me...
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Actually humans like to think they are smarter but intelligence is normally correlated by the amount of folding in the brain. (The more wrinkly your brain is the more intelligent you are) That being said Elephants have more brain folding than humans and Odontoceti (dolphins) have the most folding. So humans may not be the smartest animals in the world after all... We did invent stuff like reality TV after all.i have no clue, althought just logically think, an elephant is dumber than us i guess
There CAN be a correlation, but there are many factors involved. The biggest issue is how much of the brain needs to be dedicated to specific body functions. For example, animals with incredible visual abilities have brains that have have large portions dedicated to visual stimulus and interpretation. A larger animal can can have a larger brain, which potentially gives it more brain cells to reason with - but that larger brain may be focused on non-reasoning functions. An animal the size of a mouse will never develop the intelect of a human because it simply does not have the number of brain cells required for it. But a large animal with a human sized brain doesn't necessarily have enough cells in the reasoning portions of the brain to compete either.
As to spiders - not a lot of potential in even the biggest of them. May be some difference between various species or sizes, but probably too small to be able to measure. And not sure how you'd measure it.
As to spiders - not a lot of potential in even the biggest of them. May be some difference between various species or sizes, but probably too small to be able to measure. And not sure how you'd measure it.
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This is a meaningless statement (with all due respect). A correlation between what?
'Intelligence' is a very poorly defined term. Do you mean capacity to bring about Shakespearian literature? Ability to understand quantum mechanics? Likelyhood to solve a maze problem in less than a minute? Capacity for recollection of data?
It's all arbitrary, which is why there can never be a correlation. The original comment/question is flawed to the point of no possible answer.
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Oh Boy Martin,
I can tell this thread is really gonna bother you.
I can tell this thread is really gonna bother you.
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actually I read an article about scientists that tried to measure the intelligence of a jumping spider. They placed the spider on a plate elevated by a wire, on one side was another plate with a prey item on it, on the other side was yet another with nothing on it. the 2 were also elevated by a wires twisted into each other. Apparently the spider was looking at the twists, analysing how she could get there for some time, running down her wire, choosing another one, and running on it to the prey item. Tests results were pretty good, something like 75% success, but I would have to find back this article...
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AAAHA here it is.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1640513/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1640513/posts
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Simon Pollard works at the University I studied at - the University of Canterbury. I've actually seen those little jumpers plan. It's impressive, to say the least.
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yeah, it's quite incredible...Do you support the theory that it could have such cognitive abilities?
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I think it's hard to argue against it.
Consciousness is defined (badly) as some sort of combination between awareness and memory/recall ability. If you recall events and can process them, you are somehow conscious. Similarly, if you are experiencing something, then you are similarly somehow conscious.
These little spiders are storing information, processing it, developing a plan, recalling that plan, and modifying it as they proceed. They seem to be ticking all the main boxes. Establishing that they are self aware is more tricky, though.
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I think that between two Ts of the same sp, the biggest one should be smarter!
Some spiders are actually able to solve complex problems, but they lack the memory and general organisation of mammals and else.
Dolphins are super bright, but the reason man outshone them is 1) we have hands so we could develop tools to ease our lives, but also knowledge transmission devices that helped us to go beyond HERE and NOW 2) a language with a syntax allowing us to inform others of events not occuring or objects not present at the moment.
Some spiders are actually able to solve complex problems, but they lack the memory and general organisation of mammals and else.
Dolphins are super bright, but the reason man outshone them is 1) we have hands so we could develop tools to ease our lives, but also knowledge transmission devices that helped us to go beyond HERE and NOW 2) a language with a syntax allowing us to inform others of events not occuring or objects not present at the moment.